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Salon Window Replacement under way

Discussion in 'Post Yacht' started by shore thing, Jan 27, 2018.

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  1. shore thing

    shore thing Member

    Joined:
    May 13, 2011
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    Location:
    Hollywood, MD
    So, like seemingly ever other old post owner, I've been battling leaky salon windows since I bought the boat. I've read all of the threads about it. Multiple times.

    It's a project I had been putting patches on just to get by while I sorted out other projects on the boat. The starboard window in particular kept getting worse, to the point where I am forced to address it properly.

    I'm pretty much done all the demo. I hate using the word "demo" when talking about the boat, but really that is what it was. The Mahogany 2x3's supporting the windows from below were far too rotten to be salvageable. Getting the support frames separated from the boat required a lot of crowbars, rubber mallets, wedges and various power tools to break away from the boat along with the 30 year old dolphinite holding it all together. A lot of the wood towards the top just shredded. I was pretty shocked by how bad it was.

    I'm going to have a local glass company make me new 1/4" laminated glass windows. My plan is to go with two pieces (fixed) for each side and set them all on one track all the way out, like the forward glass was originally.

    Here's my question for the group... What material should I use to rebuild the window frames. I'm interested in hearing the pro's and cons of the different options. Right now I'm leaning towards 1x3" Coosa board. I won't have to worry about it rotting again, and 1" starboard is 3 times the price. I'm also leaning towards exact rerplacements of the the window tracks. Beckson has them, and I think barbour plastics does as well.

    What about just going with traditional wood? I could laminate marine ply to my desired thickness and epoxy it to seal it. I could source some mahogany locally somewhere (probably). What would my cheapest option be? What would my best option be? Any other types of wood i should consider? What about the tracks? Now that I'm going with fixed, is there a better option than the plastic 1/4" U channel?

    This is a job I am only going to do once, so I want to do it right. However, if price was never an issue, I'd have a much newer 50 instead of my 1981 42! All comments and thoughts are welcome!

    IMG_2638-800x600.jpg
  2. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

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    I have just installed one of many new fiberglass framed windows on a Hatteras.
    New laminated and tinted glass is sealed in fiberglass frames. The frames are epoxied in place.
    Not for the faint hearted checkbook but IMO, the best fixed window.
    http://www.boatwindowframes.com
  3. Davidoc

    Davidoc Senior Member

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    Winter:Delray Beach, Fl Summer: Bahamas
    Well, as I mentioned before somewhere, I chose to put it back together exactly how it was built. I used mahogany, teak, oyster white awl-grip, original bedding compound for sealer and original plastic window runners tacked with bronze nails. I was trying to keep her original and Post was still around at the time so they helped me with some knowledge and parts suppliers where needed. I wanted to keep the windows capable of opening. I was able to reuse the original glass. It was tempered and tinted. I then had it tinted darker after installation. I also spent a lot of time compounding the glass on the weather side to polish off any old calcium stains etc. I did my window job on my 91 in 2007 and they are still working like new except the tint I had done needs to be replaced.
    I also wanted to keep her original with the wood and bedding material so if the boat flexed here and there, nothing would be rigid and the glass would ride better. Good luck
  4. My Affair

    My Affair Member

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    What compound did you use to remove the stains. Thanks
  5. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    Imar makes a window polish for glass windows that is really good. Otherwise you could use wink.
  6. Davidoc

    Davidoc Senior Member

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    Winter:Delray Beach, Fl Summer: Bahamas
    I tried a number of cleaners and scalers on the outside surface with the windows laying on a large flat table. In the end, the best mix with out a machine, was 3M finesse or the next heavier one, with baking soda and some vinegar. The trick is to cut the old scale while watching not to scratch the glass. You can feel and see the old water scale come off without a scratch. I put rain X on after they were clean. We were an IMAR dealer for a while and used most of their products. I couldn't get the old salt water scale off with anything non abrasive.
  7. praetorian47

    praetorian47 Member

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    Location:
    Bayport, Midland, Ontario
    Carpro makes a hard water spot remover that works well, but follow the instructions closely - don't apply in direct sunlight. It dries too fast.

    Carpro and others make window sealants, but I've had mixed results with them. Sea-shield has a glass clean and polish system that I've found to be the best over the last few years. Prep is a bit of work, but if you watch the videos, it makes sense and it really does work. I found that treated windows had less spots and cleaned easier for the summer.

    Aquapel is another product I've read good things about and looks very easy to apply. I bought some but haven't used them yet. I plan on doing my boat windows before spring, and my truck window as soon as it warms up enough.

    I recently bought a Denali pickup and use it all the time. My previous car was a Porsche Macan. The Denali is so much more versatile I disnt use the macan for 6 months even once. The biggest issue with the Denali is the windows. They don't defog as well or do the wipers work as well. Now I just realized, as I'm writing this, that my macan window was treated with Carpro window treatment. Maybe that's the big difference? I'm going to try to treat the window today with aquapel and see!
  8. mwwhit1

    mwwhit1 Senior Member

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    Back to the original post: Since you had to remove the entire top and bottom wood, you have more options available than I did reusing the old stuff: http://www.yachtforums.com/threads/salon-window-replacement-sliding-to-fixed.24663/#post-221575

    To me, your key item is to design the install for relatively easy removal of the glass should it break. (I had someone pushing against a piling with their butt against the window and it cracked. It can happen that easily). I'm sure you are caulking the outside, and I can tell you that caulk alone holds the glass really well. I don't think you need to support the glass with the plastic tracks as much as they were before. For the front piece of glass: use the plastic track inside the routered front windshield support. I think the bottom and top wood can be flat. Maybe rest the glass on a piece of rubber for some cushion. I think a small spacer piece of wood at the end of the glass on the outside top and bottom. Then on the inside of the glass install a length of wood along the top and bottom with screws to hold the glass in, but they can be removed if needed. Back piece of glass has the same vertical track set in. I left about an inch of space between the glass so they can be slid enough to come out of these end tracks for replacement.

    As for the type of wood to use, I don't think it makes that much difference. Since you will have no more water getting in, rot won't be an issue. Still probably worth sealing with epoxy for extra protection. I think your inside mahogany pieces for looks, are the wood type to think about.

    Hope this makes sense. Mark
  9. shore thing

    shore thing Member

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    Thanks Mark, that is helpful. I like your idea of only using the tracks in the forward section of the window, and for using a thin strip of rubber under the glass and a cleat method for holding the glass in. So far that seems like the most logical path. I'm leaning towards not replacing inside pieces with replacement mahogany. I'm not confident i'll get a great match to the rest of the interior. I'm thinking of building a frame around the windows and covering it in headliner material. (i'm also doing new headliner in the salon). This is along the lines of what I'm thinking about for the covered window frame....

    window treatment (Medium).jpg
  10. Bill106

    Bill106 Senior Member

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    A fabric may have issues when the windows sweat, common when there's a big differential in temps inside and out. I'd opt for wood, epoxy and UV coated.
  11. shore thing

    shore thing Member

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    That's definitely something to consider but I plan to use naugahyde on my headliner and window valances. I'll look into it a bit more, but I wouldn't think it would be much of an issue since it's rated for outdoor use.
  12. mwwhit1

    mwwhit1 Senior Member

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    I was thinking of another thing. There really is no reason to make the bottom vertical face board as big as it was from Post. I'm sure they had the 3" above the tracks to catch water. You could make it look really slick by creating a U shaped piece. Combine the cleat, the small vertical, and a lower fastening cleat. Slide over and screw from underneath into your lower window frame piece. If you can get it to butt up against the salon wall, you would never even see the wood your are contemplating. It would improve looking out while sitting down by a few inches, plus a nice clean finish with no fasteners showing. The top should probably stay like it was with a valence to hide the blinds hardware. Crazy idea?
  13. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

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    That is beautiful. Great trim.
    I found long ago, red oak as a replacement for mahogany with clear varnish. Seemed to hold up better around windows that sweated.
  14. James S White

    James S White New Member

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    Location:
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    Hi,

    I'm in the process of replacing my windows. However, am having a difficult time removing the bottom piece of wood. This is the inside piece that runs the entire length of the window and into the corner (wire run). Did you have any issues? Any suggestions?

    Thanks,

    Jim
  15. shore thing

    shore thing Member

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    If you are trying to remove and salvage the piece of wood, I can’t help you. Post glued it to the fiberglass using what I believe is dolphinite. I had to saw, chip, pry, scrape and sand to get it off. Needless to say, it came off in many pieces. I wasn’t trying to salvage mine though, as it had rot from the window leak.
  16. James S White

    James S White New Member

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    Thank you...it seemed like it wasn't going to come off. Thankfully, I don't have rot on that piece.
  17. shore thing

    shore thing Member

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    No problem. Also, there are bungs covering screws every 8 inches or so, that would need to come out if you decided to remove it. That was the easy part though.

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