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Where Are The Donzi Folks?

Discussion in 'Donzi/Roscioli Yacht' started by DOCKMASTER, Feb 11, 2015.

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  1. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    Cat C18 acerts are 1150hp, they burn 85 gph at 80% load. I would say your Detroits on their best day are putting out 1000hp and probably even less now. That combined with some weight savings from the Cats, you'd see a 4-5 knot increase. But CAT has nothing really between the c 18 and C32. So you're either a 6 cylinder or massive 12 cylinder.

    Hp is HP and it takes X amount of fuel to make X amount of HP on a modern diesel. You have enough fuel, and I forget what 10v2000's burn, I ran one set at 1400hp or somewhere around there, and I think they were 120GPH for the pair at 80% load. I didn't like the way they ran, they were in a 64' Hatteras MY, you'd get to around 1950rpms, the one turbo would cut out the boat would fall on it's face and drop to 1850rpms, then the other turbo would cut in and quickly start accelerating again, it was odd. Like being on a bucking bronco. I ran the boat from WPB,FL to St. Michaels, MD probably 5 years ago. They are not a very common engine at all and in that HP range C32's are found in most all SF in MY's till you get to the 16v2000 range, also Viking put them in a SF in the beginning and found they were way overpropped based on their initial calculations of what prop they should be running in that hull and came to the conclusion they didn't make the HP they claimed.

    What HP MTU's did they use to get 30 knots?
  2. Bamboo

    Bamboo Senior Member

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    I've not heard great things about the 8/10 V2000's, even the m-93's. Only one boat I know has the 10-2000's.
    I love "my" Donzi; it's a great boat in all sea conditions and it's super roomy. It looks awesome and I get more looks at any dock than just about other boat when we travel up and down the coast.
    I've been busy so I didn't see this thread until today...
  3. DOCKMASTER

    DOCKMASTER Member

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    Can you expand a bit on what issues you have heard about with the MTU's? Thanks.
  4. Bamboo

    Bamboo Senior Member

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    When the M-93's came out there was much anticipation for the whole series- 8/10/12 and 16's. With the added HP the 10's could be used where previously the 12's were needed. Viking Yachts tried it and found the 8's and 10's did not produce as expected and they did not use them to any great extent, and other manufacturers seemed to follow suit. I say this as I used to work for Viking at the FL yard and it's what I heard while there and shortly after I left. I don't see them (8's/10's) in many other sportfish vessels. We do have a smaller Jarrett Bay in my marina with the 10's and the captain says they are "okay". I don't think MTU has sold and installed many of them, and I don't see them often. The 12's and 16's? Quite common and and industry standard in the m91, m93 and m94 versions. Remember this is just my professional opinion and info so take it with a grain of salt. The 10's may make a great engine for your boat; I think they are worth further investigation- but there is a reason why there seems to be so few compared to the popularity of the 12's and 16's.
  5. DOCKMASTER

    DOCKMASTER Member

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    Thanks for the info, much appreciated. I'll do some research and see what I can find. Any suggestions for other engines to consider as a replacement for the current 12v92's? I was hoping to gain at least 300 hp per side minimum.
  6. water-baby

    water-baby Member

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    Busy..... What's going on with the sea deuce ? That thread is in need of an update just sayin..........
  7. Bamboo

    Bamboo Senior Member

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    Have you looked at the MAN products? They have 12 cylinder models rated at 1400, 1550 and 1800 hp. I don't to look like I'm endorsing them- but the only three companies to consider are MAN, CAT and MTU imho.
  8. DOCKMASTER

    DOCKMASTER Member

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    There are so few MANs in the Pacific NW and even fewer in Alaska service and parts are hard to come by. I have business relationships with the commercial divisions of both CAT and MTU so that helps with things quite a bit.
  9. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    Then I'd be taking a hard look at CAT, since we both told you the exact same thing about the MTU's. However the ones I ran in the Hatteras did cruise it at 26.5 knots which is about right in the HP department.
  10. DOCKMASTER

    DOCKMASTER Member

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    Thanks for all the input. I'll continue researching. I'm not in a hurry so want to take my time and do this right the first time.
  11. Bamboo

    Bamboo Senior Member

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    I think the 10v2000 m94's might be 1625 hp. M93 are 1500 iirc. With that hp in your 58 you may not experience the symptoms Capt J speaks of due to the higher hp for the size of the vessel. Proper consultations are in order to determine if they are a good match. M94's would be pricey but you'd have the fastest 58 our there I'd guess.
  12. DOCKMASTER

    DOCKMASTER Member

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    I'm not certain about the current HP rating as the spec sheets I have are two years old. I know of another 54' Donzi that was repowered back in 02' using the 1480 hp 12v2000's. He is running 31-32 knots at cruise of 1,850 RPM. When I spoke to this vessel owner a few years ago he said he loves the MTU's. I realize the model has changed now and MTU has gone from the 12v to the the 10v.

    Of course, that being said, I also see lots of great feedback from people very happy with CAT C-18's. I'm going to start a comparision table of these options and also include the MTU 8v2000 which are pretty close to same HP as the C-18's. I'll compare fuel burn to power curves, speed (estimated), fuel per mile, size, weight, modifications necessary and total cost. This should help me in making a decision.
  13. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    C 18's would be your cheapest route by far. You could still utilize your existing running gear. Quite honestly I wouldn't even consider 8v2000's there are very very few of them out there for good reason, parts are hard to come by, and the C18 is a very proven and reliable motor. I ran one boat with 8v183 MTU's also a low production motor and parts were a royal pain to source at times, meanwhile you can get 12v183 parts all day every day.

    If you want to go faster 10v2000's are a consideration or go with the tried and true and also bulletproof C32s. But you're going to have a huge jump in fuel consumption, engine cost, and running gear for possibly 5 knots faster. Resale would be considerably easier with the Cat option. Man's would also be a 2nd consideration for me.

    You don't see SF manufacturers using 8v and 10v2000's and there are reasons for that. In a SF Cat's are the leader, then Man's in popularity (until you get into the 16v2000's).
  14. DOCKMASTER

    DOCKMASTER Member

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    Thanks for the input Capt J. The C-32's would be great from a hp and reliability standpoint but they are just too big. They would be 11" longer, 8" wider and 6" taller than the current DD engines. There is not a lot of room with the existing engines so going bigger would not really work. Further, the C-32's are 1,400#'s heavier (each) than the DD's. So the C-32's are out as a possibility.

    The C-18's on the other hand are 3" longer, 5" narrower and virtually same height as the DD's. They are also 1,100#'s lighter than the DD's and a whopping 2,500#'s lighter than the C-32's. So the C-18's are definitly a possiblity.

    The 10v2000's are all around smaller and lighter than the DD's. The effective length (gear mounts under exhaust outlet reducing total length) is 3" shorter, they are 6" narrower and 2" shorter. They weigh 400#'s less than the DD's but 700#'s more than the C-18's. Gaining some clearance, particularly on width is pretty appealing.

    I still have to do overall comparisions including gears and dimensions to coupling faces, etc. And I haven't done the fuel burn comparisions. Obviously the 10v's will be higher at the higher hp rating but I need to try to compare the differences in similiar power band spots.

    The idea of being able to retain the existing running gear is pretty big and I'm a fan of CAT's as I had them in my last boat and loved them.

    Lots of things to consider!
  15. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    Have you given Bob Roscioli a call and asked about his input. I'm sure he'd love to talk to you and might have more insight than we do.

    If cost is a factor and everything else. It looks like C18 acerts are the way to go. If you don't mind spending $150k more (between running gear, motor price etc.) then 10v2000's seem a viable option, but I think I'd go with Man's before them. But what do you gain with the larger expense, a lot more fuel burn, 5 knots maybe, a lot more upfront and some maintanence expense.....
  16. Donzi 54

    Donzi 54 Member

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    If I was doing it all over again I would be looking for at least 1400hp. It made a huge difference how the boat runs.
  17. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    What engines did you repower with?
  18. Donzi 54

    Donzi 54 Member

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    MTU 12v2000.. If I was to do it again I would lean towards MTU but I would certainly consider all options. That was back in 2002 I can't imagine the cost of the engines today.
  19. DOCKMASTER

    DOCKMASTER Member

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    Thanks Donzi 54

    I have had an ongoing dialogue with Donzi 54 to get all of the info from his repower. He has been most helpful. His 12v2000's are 1500 hp.
  20. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    It depends what you're looking for in expense versus speed and fuel burn. My experiences have been the same as bamboo's, I have not heard great things about the 10v2000's, and 1400HP seems like a lot to squeeze out of those 10 cylinders. I only ran one set. However, C32's don't make any sense in your boat either. At this time, personally, my considerations would be between C18 acerts (only motor I'd consider in the 1150hp range), then Man's or possibly the 10v2000 if you're seeking more HP. But I'd probably go Man over 10v2000 honestly.

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