Click for Abeking Click for Cheoy Lee Click for Nordhavn Click for Cross Click for Westport

What defines an Expedition Yacht?

Discussion in 'Popular Yacht Topics' started by YachtForums, Mar 18, 2013.

  1. Ju52

    Ju52 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2006
    Messages:
    148
    Location:
    Frankfurt
  2. YachtForums

    YachtForums Administrator

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2002
    Messages:
    19,953
    Location:
    South Florida
    While Wiki is a wonderful resource, I would trust YF's collective knowledge for definitions or definitive answers on anything related to yachts long before any other source on the web.
  3. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2005
    Messages:
    14,055
    Location:
    Fort Lauderdale
    They built the 80' Northern Marine purposefully to carry such items. The 2003 I used to run had a very very large crane installed from the factory (I forget the exact capacity). The factory had a 24' aluminum fishing boat, it was a weird dual console boat (shown in the picture on the website), it also had a 20' rib and the owners later added a few scooters to the mix......The factory sold this one new, then took it back in trade a year or so later because the initial owner ordered a larger Northern Marine. The factory retained ownership for about two years and used it for their own fun and to show the boat, and then took it back to the factory in Seattle or Vancouver on it's own bottom and then did some changes and sold it to the current owner and his son. Who then cruised it back from the factory, all of the way down to Brasil, up to Ft. Laud, then NY, then the Med on her own bottom about 2 years ago. Last I heard from the owner, it's still over there. The factory got rid of the 24' dual console boat here in Ft. Lauderdale because they decided it wasn't suited for anywhere else except the Pacific Northwest before they sold the NM to the current owner.
  4. HTMO9

    HTMO9 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2009
    Messages:
    1,593
    Location:
    Europe
    Definition of boat type

    Who cares about the definition of the type of boat one owns. Everybody for example can submerge a ship. But I would only call it a submarine if it can come up again by itself.:)

    Cheers
  5. carelm

    carelm Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2011
    Messages:
    407
    Location:
    fairfax va
    You could call it an artificial reef at least for a while since it sank a while back.:D Some the neighbors called it an eyesore and were glad it sank.

    Luxury houseboat sinks at Lake Tahoe marina
  6. Opcn

    Opcn Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2009
    Messages:
    478
    Location:
    Nordland (near Port Townsend), WA, USA
    Do you know if it ever came out what sank it?
  7. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2005
    Messages:
    14,055
    Location:
    Fort Lauderdale
    Well, if someone told you they drive a sports car, when in reality they drive a Ford Expedition SUV, wouldn't you look at them funny and think there's something not quite right with them? :)
  8. HTMO9

    HTMO9 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2009
    Messages:
    1,593
    Location:
    Europe
    Definition

    I found Your comprehensive defintion of an expedition Yacht perfectly correct.
    I just wanted to release some steam from the boiler (by means of a little joke).

    I have a good friend who owns an hystorical 80 ft wooden sailing cutter. One day he hit (at full blow) a wooden pier and destroyed it completely without any damage to his good old boat. Since ever that day, he calls himself a destroyer captain and his boat the last real destroyer. We could bearly prevent him from painting a big panel number on his bow and raising the WW I war flag.:D

    I just wanted to say that boating is fun !!!!

    Cheers
  9. AlfredZ

    AlfredZ Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2009
    Messages:
    566
    Location:
    Landlocked in Europe
  10. Fishtigua

    Fishtigua Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2007
    Messages:
    2,843
    Location:
    Guernsey/Antigua

    Attached Files:

    • ford.jpg
      ford.jpg
      File size:
      62.8 KB
      Views:
      1,535
  11. JWY

    JWY Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2004
    Messages:
    1,395
    Location:
    Ft. Lauderdale
    I wanna write the review :D

    Judy
  12. PacBlue

    PacBlue Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2009
    Messages:
    1,976
    Location:
    Dana Point, Ca

    The Northern Marine's listed for sale have davits ranging from 2500 - 3500 lbs. Just right for a 15/18/20' Rib. With the davit on centerline, you can fill up the boat deck with whatever combination you like, pending builder approval.

    Look at a CC - Contender 21'/3550 lbs, 23'/4750 lbs, 25'/6250 lbs, or try Regulator 23'/5420 lbs, 24'/6250 lbs, full up, ready to go, wet loaded weights. The 25' CC dreamboat is just not happening.
  13. PacBlue

    PacBlue Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2009
    Messages:
    1,976
    Location:
    Dana Point, Ca
    Sycara IV is many things, including a beautiful work of art, straight from the drawing board of a transplanted West coaster, Mr. Bruce King, the man behind the designs of the old Ericson sailboat company in Costa Mesa, Ca. But contrary to what Boat International calls her in their write-up/brochure, she is not a full displacement yacht. With an advertised displacement of 180 tons and a waterline of 118 feet, her Displacement to Length Ratio comes in at a svelt 109, not even close to an accepted norm for Full Displacement Yachts (about 300 +/- 50 depending on who you talk to, for modern boats).

    Now a Northern Marine 84 with a displacement of 155.6 tons and a waterline of about 75' comes in at a stout 368. A true full displacement MY.
  14. Opcn

    Opcn Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2009
    Messages:
    478
    Location:
    Nordland (near Port Townsend), WA, USA
    Where does this idea about displacement and length come from?

    Full displacement is in reference to the hull geometry, and how the load is fully carried by the buoyant force of the water displaced. This stands in contrast to a planing hull where in the action of the plane of the boat hull forces water down and Newtonian mechanics (3rd law) forces the hull up as an opposite but equal reaction, in what is called hydrodynamic lift.

    There are of course weigh parameters beyond which you cannot expect hydrodynamic lift to function adequately to raise the boat up and reduce drag, but that doesn't mean that a full displacement boat suddenly stops being one if it doesn't have so much weight that a different hull of the same length couldn't lift it hydrodynamically.
  15. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2005
    Messages:
    14,055
    Location:
    Fort Lauderdale
    A 24' Pathfinder center console with 225hp Yamaha 4 stroke weighs 2950lbs.
    A Yellowfin 24' bay boat comes in at 3050 lbs loaded
    a 25.1' Scout comes in at 2300lbs sans engine
    A 243 Everglades is 3500lbs without engine
    A 24' or 26 Carolina skiff sea chaser........

    Why is it that you cannot do your own research? Just because the 10 year old 80' Northern Marine's are outfitted with 2500-3500lb davits/crane, why couldn't a heavier one be installed by the factory as an option? Is a 24' Pathfinder at 2950lbs still under the 3500lb davit......granted it's too close for my comfort when you consider fuel and other weight....but can be done.....
  16. PacBlue

    PacBlue Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2009
    Messages:
    1,976
    Location:
    Dana Point, Ca
    Thanks for clarifying your research for me - now I can rest easy knowing that an Expedition application which would be operating in somewhat remote locations and would require top notchequipment would be well advised to to use a skiff/bay boat as it's choice of tender. Why not throw in a flats boat while you are at it. Since you are including dry weight, no gear/rigging, and no engine for the Everglades, maybe they can keep all that stuff in the lazarette and rig her up each time?

    Those selections would certainly be logical as a 25CC instead of a real one that has safe seakeeping, decent freeboard and a good load carrying capability.

    The guy who can swing the $$$ for the mothership would certainly be interested in a Pathfinder product to trust in while exploring the oceans, as he is looking to save some really money here. I bet he even has a Kia in his garage at home!

    Thanks for the research effort, but I will pass on the results.
  17. PacBlue

    PacBlue Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2009
    Messages:
    1,976
    Location:
    Dana Point, Ca
    Thanks for the lesson in Naval Architecture, I really never heard that one before and I just pulled my own comparison out of my A$$, relying on nothing published or understood before in that field of study.

    I hear they have long winters up in your neck of the woods, take some time next year to educate yourself some more on the topic.
  18. Opcn

    Opcn Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2009
    Messages:
    478
    Location:
    Nordland (near Port Townsend), WA, USA
    Are you an NA?

    I real a lot, please tell me more about where I can read about the new addition to the definition of a displacement hull. I've really never ever heard of it before.
  19. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2005
    Messages:
    14,055
    Location:
    Fort Lauderdale
    The Pathfinder is a very stout boat, has good load carrying capacity, and it also makes a whole lot more sense than a full blown center console. You have a lot more versatility of where you can go and fish. You can do offshore fishing, flats fishing, get into all kinds of nooks and crannies in rivers and estuaries and explore a lot of places you can't get a 25' Contender into. Most of the fisherman I know, love inshore fishing just as much as offshore fishing. I think if you contacted Northern Marine, I'm pretty sure you could have the boat built with a larger crane and get your 25' contender on their. I have been on a 24' Pathfinder in 3-5' seas and it handles them fine. If you're on a true Expedition, you're also not on a schedule and can pick your days of when to go fishing offshore in your tender as well.

    As with anything in yachting, there are always compromises. Just like you surely aren't going to be as confortable in a big sea on a 80' as you are on a 150' all other things being equal. Just the same with the tender you're capable of carrying. There are some 200-250' expedition yachts that carry 45' full blown sportfishes on them. 80' is the bottom end of the size an Expedition yacht and still be considered an expedition yacht, so yes you're not going to be carrying around a 45' Sportfish like the bigger expedition yachts do. One of the Northern Marine's for sale currently has a 22' or 23' center console RIB on it.

    You can also get a 22' or 26' Panga center console weighing in at 3,000 lbs (or less) and fisherman have been taking those boats out commercial fishing in all sorts of seas and all sorts of countries safely for decades. I'd feel a lot safer in a 26' Panga in a sea than a traditional 25' center console such as a contender/regulator. Plus you'll blend in with the locals in a lot of places and not attract unwanted attention. Try going up the Belize river in a nice center console.....LOL

    You know the problem is, when people give you answers, you then add more specifications and raise the bar even higher and are never satisfied.
  20. K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2005
    Messages:
    7,369
    Location:
    My Office
    Hi,

    Any hull can be made to plane.

    You just need enough HP and to be able to get the power transmitted to the water and away you go.