Click for Abeking Click for ZF Click for United Click for Dockmate Click for JetForums

The smallest boats with a standing-height engine room?

Discussion in 'Technical Discussion' started by Amicus curiae, Sep 6, 2019.

You need to be registered and signed in to view this content.
  1. Amicus curiae

    Amicus curiae New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2014
    Messages:
    6
    Location:
    Helsinki
    Greetings,

    When watching videos on motorboats and yachts, especially on the smaller ones, the engine space or engine room dimensions might not even get mentioned in the walk-in video, let alone shown. Same difference (or indifference..) with the specs sheets.

    I might never be able to buy my "dream boat", but if I'd get that lucky, I'd want a semi- or displacement motorboat with two cabins (sleeping 2-4 persons), standing-height engine room, preferably IPS, or thruster joysticks (for easier handling), and having as low draft as possible, given the engine room height thing. And the boat itself ought to be as "small" as possible, to make it easier for two persons to handle.

    The boat would be used mainly in the Scandinavian and Finnish archipelago and the Nordic lakes. And a speedboat I'm not looking for.

    Since I haven't goat a "boating history", a professional captain / machinist would be hired for a considerable time to teach me . Before buying any boat I'd rent one and before that take extensive classes, perhaps buy RYA or some such outfit. The maintenance of the boat would be done by hired professionals.

    Please consider this more like a theoretical question / general interest on the concept a of small boat having a proper engine room, rather than an opportunity to give me a shower of "answers" saying "why don't you start with a canoe, why the heck do you want an real engine room rather than a miserable, black hole under the deck" :eek:etc.

    I hope to get some boat brands and specific model names as answers to this posting, if at all possible.

    Thanks for any - especially relevant - input.

    :)

    AC
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2019
  2. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2005
    Messages:
    11,432
    Location:
    Fort Lauderdale
    The smallest boat I know of with a standup engine room was the old 53' Hatteras MY. Most of the newer IPS/POD boats don't have a standup engine room by any means.
  3. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2004
    Messages:
    7,499
    Location:
    Satsuma, FL
    The later ideas are, less engine room, more people room.
    One of the great reasons of Z drives and pods.
    Lately the outboard is winning the max people room again.
    Your going to have to go back years (years) to find a Hatteras, SouthernCross, Roughwater, Chris Roamer Houseboat & defever for a stand up engine room in the 50 to 60 LOA.
    I used to be 2.03m tall. And enjoyed working on these older models. Now 1.95m (and still shrinking) from working in newer models.

    From Florida USA, J & I work on the local boats to us. I don't have a lot of knowledge of the boats in your part of the world.

    Some of your specs are a bit long reaching anywhere. Good luck. Keep us up on what you find to help all learn.

    ,Ralph
  4. Amicus curiae

    Amicus curiae New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2014
    Messages:
    6
    Location:
    Helsinki
    Thanks, Capt J and Capt Ralph,

    Funnily enough, rather soon after posting my question I bumped into a couple of videos on Nordhavn 59 Coastal Pilot.

    Some specs of said vessel:

    LOA 17.92 M
    LWL: 50’10” / 15.49 M
    Beam: 5.18 M
    Draft: 5´0” / 1.52 M


    On the first video, Introducing the Nordhavn 59 Coastal Pilot with Jim Leishman (a 30 min video) Jim Leishman, Owner/ vice president PAE speaks about the engine room of 59 CP, saying things like " (...) "Six foot plus standing room. You can walk upright on the outboard side of each engine. The engine room is [going to be] unrivaled, (…) it’s [going to be] a major selling point of this boat. (…) Fantastic ventilation… (…) This engine room will be more impressive than what we have in the 86, to be honest.”

    The video can be found here: (The link below jumps directly to the engine room part)



    Nordhavn 59 CP specs etc:

    https://nordhavn.com/models/n59cp/

    A N59CP "Video update" (showing the engine room):



    I was happy to see that a proper engine room on a non-gigantic boat is not an extinct species, yet.

    And Capt Ralph, so right you are about the accursed trend re engine room size.

    This paradigm of less engine room, more people room seems to be the curse of the automobile industry, too. People want more room for people, plus more luggage room in the boot - and as a result, I guess, they must build the car around the engine - that's the only way to fit it in...

    Boating is supposed to be fun. And one is supposed to keep checking several things on the engine, repeatedly, to keep it in good health. I am not at my happiest fixing anything standing on my head in a dark, tight hole, or doing it while squatting, bent twice over like a contortionist, my cheek all the while caressing a red-hot engine...

    P.S. I tried to place merely the links of the videos to my msg, but for some reason the actual videos appeared on the page. I wonder what went wrong.

    AC
    Last edited: Sep 7, 2019
  5. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2004
    Messages:
    7,499
    Location:
    Satsuma, FL
    Nordhavn uh. Been on one with a single Cummins. Mid fifties I think. A short person can stand over the engine if I remember.
    I did not think of them when I was trying to remember boats with tall engine rooms. Sorry I did not mention them.
    I do think of them as expensive slow boats. Please search past threads on Nordhavn and PAE. Some new order/build issues.
    If your searching for used, should not be a problem.


  6. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2005
    Messages:
    11,432
    Location:
    Fort Lauderdale
    If your search is a pod boat. I've never had to spend much time to speak of in the engine room of a pod boat, as there isn't much to maintain, so I never saw the issue of not having a stand up engine room in them, same with most of the newer boats. The old boats were standup because quite frankly it was nearly impossible to keep them clean enough to sit down and work. Most of the things I'm changing, such as an A/C pump, or cleaning strainers, etc. I'm sitting down for. As long as I can sit comfortably and work, I'm good.

    The worst engine room I remember working in was a 1998 58' azimut. You had to go through the aft deck and then a crawl through hatch in the galley to get to the back half of the motors and generator and some things, and then you had to go through the floor hatch on the aft deck to get to the front of the motors and other things because the engines were so close together. It was definitely crawl all over AND it had the sharpest aluminum diamond plate, I ever saw to boot.
  7. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2004
    Messages:
    7,499
    Location:
    Satsuma, FL
    58' Viking Princess with V10 MANs come to mind on a BAD engine room.
    Had to squeeze on one side between the mains and could only work with one arm to replace the center-line A/C pump.
    Condensing stations were on the outside of the mains. If they needed to be replaced, the outside exhaust manifold had to be removed first.
    Oh, I could stand up sideways between the engines. smily_ROTFL.gif
  8. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2005
    Messages:
    11,432
    Location:
    Fort Lauderdale
    I had one of those......I think an old either 58' or 61. You had to pull up the salon carpet, move the couch and take the floor hatches off and work through the salon to do **** near anything on them besides check the oil.
  9. d_meister

    d_meister Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2010
    Messages:
    222
    Location:
    San Diego, CA.
    Bad engine rooms could be a long and popular forum thread. A 92' Tarrab, comes to mind. Literally had to crawl over the top of the Detroit 12v92's on your belly to get outboard. You can stand in it, though o_O
  10. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2004
    Messages:
    7,499
    Location:
    Satsuma, FL
    Worked on a Cat powered Tiara. You can not see or reach the outside raw pump. Had to sub a tall skinny tech from Huckins. One arm, nothing in sight. Near 90 minutes.
  11. Amicus curiae

    Amicus curiae New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2014
    Messages:
    6
    Location:
    Helsinki
    Capt Ralph,

    Did a search on past threads on Nordhavn / PAE regarding "some new order/build issues". Read dozens of pages of testimonials, saw too many photographs of rather unbeliavable installations via links provided within the threads.

    What should I say..? A negative Wow or OMG come readily to mind. But beyond that?

    Well, I don't want to poison anyone's mind against any company, but I sincerely feel anybody thinking of commissioning a yacht from Nordhavn / PAE absolutely should meticulously go through those posts and links and all additional data available. That's just due diligence.

    Of course, people should do similar "problem/issue" discussion and web searches on whichever company they consider ordering a yacht from. Early on.

    Companies that have no skeletons in the cupboard are just happy if a potential customer is profoundly interested in their history, in their past milestones, in the quality of their products at its best and worst.

    And if one as a customer is not interested in due diligence, then it probably pays off to get an expensive lawyer and a cheap boat...
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2019
  12. Natuzzi

    Natuzzi Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2011
    Messages:
    58
    Location:
    Portorož
    Allthough it doesn't fall into your desired spec, Seafaring 34 (44' as well) has a massive engine room, you could seriously host a leprechaun party down there. No standing height though...
  13. C42

    C42 New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2017
    Messages:
    7
    Location:
    Germany/Italy
    If you want a (relatively) small boat with a good sized engine room, I’d look at a Bavaria.

    We currently own a 2012 Bavaria 43 hardtop with IPS600. Engine room is huge (also on the smaller models) and the boats offer great value for money, especially with their roomy interiors (beam is 4,41m) and just overall space on board.
    There are 2- and 3-cabin versions available, but we were looking for the 2-cabin style.

    The successor of the 43 sport/ht is the 450 sport/ht. It basically is the same hull but revised design. Oh, and the engine room is smaller now (a lot less headroom) as the tender garage/storage compartment is now fixed and doesn’t open up completely as it does on our boat.

    Best regards from Germany,
    Tim

    47D62AF7-369C-44FE-93C5-3400AC1DE373.jpeg

    Engine room access (sun pad & storage compartment lift up):
    E604076E-A7ED-423F-82A8-B43693FE8458.jpeg

    488AF0FD-0F3D-4E29-A067-CF469A0B0BB7.jpeg
  14. Amicus curiae

    Amicus curiae New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2014
    Messages:
    6
    Location:
    Helsinki
    Thanks, Tim! Will absolutely have a look at Bavarias.

    Hals und Beinbruch :D ,

    AC
  15. Rusty Mayes

    Rusty Mayes New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2019
    Messages:
    6
    Location:
    Sanfransico Bay area
    I've been looking into 50 ish Pilot house boats and one attribute that I desire is a large engine room. The 55 Symbol Pilot house has a two stateroom layout and a nice standup engine room housing two 450 Diamond series Cummins.
  16. Amicus curiae

    Amicus curiae New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2014
    Messages:
    6
    Location:
    Helsinki
    Rusty (et al.),

    It is so nice to get comments and answers from people who know boats, and share similar interests.

    And who have done both boat and soul searching...

    And fwiw, I enjoy Yachtforums immensely, because one can be a n00b, uninformed etc, but here nobody puts you down just to show how experienced, ”important” or knowledgeable in the world of wet element vessels they are

    AC / mk
  17. Big Tich

    Big Tich New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2019
    Messages:
    12
    Location:
    Nashville
    Take a look at a 44ft Gulfstar. It has a stand up engine room. Crazy! Might not be the boat for you, but the engine room on that size boat should win a prize.
  18. Norseman

    Norseman Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2005
    Messages:
    2,070
    Location:
    Ft. Lauderdale
    We had a few of those, but they tend to disappear, fortunately :p
  19. johnrupp

    johnrupp New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2016
    Messages:
    3
    Location:
    Chesapeake Bay
    Kadey Krogen 39
  20. Pascal

    Pascal Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2008
    Messages:
    4,616
    Location:
    Miami, FL
    I remember looking at a small Vicem a few years back which had a very nice stand up ER.

    That s an engine compartment on that Bavaria. Not an ER. Have to move everyone off the cockpit is a pita. Then a ladder landing on the hot exhaust and no floor boards...

Share This Page