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MTU SERIES 60 DIESEL ENGINE

Discussion in 'Engines' started by KRAIGKAV, May 14, 2017.

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  1. bayoubud

    bayoubud Senior Member

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    rcapps, that MTU name for parts is what concerns me. The engine seems to have a good reputation. Just wondering if they are going obsolete and need to be on the no buy list.
  2. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    No issues getting parts for a long time....you can widely get parts for the old 2 cycle DD's and they last made those in 1998.
  3. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

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    MTU is probably still supporting their model #1 from the 1930 & 40s.
    I believe (until proven different) MTU is the only marienizer of the series 60.
    174 USCG boats are not going to get powered by a questionable service and future part supply issue.

    Like it's older brother, the 71s, there are just too many 60s out there to not support.
    Eventually, non-OEM parts (cost reduced) will start coming available.

    ANY Detroit shop can work on it. The special tools are in every body's tool box (On & Off road).

    Sorry nobody answered you on the MTU 8V 2000 M93. I would of liked a comparison between the V-8 vs the straight 6 myself.
    IMHO, straight blocks can offer more HP and less crankshaft issues per cylinder than V blocks. But an owners comments on the MTU V-8 would of been nice.

    Here in S Georgia, I don't work on many other MTU rigs. FL/DD-A gets most of these calls.
    I get a few repeat customers for normal service on the 60s.
  4. bayoubud

    bayoubud Senior Member

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  5. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    I spoke to a guy who operates high ferry boats in the USVI's, they have a set of 8v2000's with I think it was 3000 hours on them so far. He said that they have been solid engines and have had no issues and no problems to speak of and that they have a lot of power.
  6. HTMO9

    HTMO9 Senior Member

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    The S60 engine was one, if not the main reason, MTU bought Detroit Diesel. They wanted the technology. Very reliable and long lasting engine in commercial applications. The engine even comes in a left and right hand version. Very handy. There were some rumours, that the production would be stopped, because the engine could not meet the higher emission standards in the future. Seems, this problem has been solved. Production is going on.

    By chance, I was invited by a jetty neighbour here in Palma harbour, a few days ago, onto his larger Nordhavn, equipped with twin MTU S60 with 600 HP each. HE cooled with wet exhausts and ZF Gear. Both had more than 6.000 hours on them. The owner was very happy with them, never had any problems and the engines and the complete engine room were very clean and looked almost new and so looked the whole boat. I was really impressed. Owner operated boat circumnavigating with 2 crew acting as 1st mate and stew/chef.

    I personally have never seen a boat with MTU 8V 2000 main engine(s). I have only seen and own them as generator engines with Leroy Somer electrical end and massive sound enclosure. Smooth and flawless running engines. CanĀ“t tell about their longevity, as the boat is fairly new but the chief loves them.

    The 8 V 2000 is most likely not so common as a propulsion engine in the yachting industry, because of weight, size and power range, this is the territory of MANs and CATs.
  7. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    I was told MTU bought DD strictly for the DDEC system. I never heard the Series 60 was one of the reasons. I run 150 different yachts a year and have run a lot of non common engines but personally have never run 8v2000s as they are pretty rare in yachts.
  8. HTMO9

    HTMO9 Senior Member

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    The DDEC system was for sure the other major reason. But the S60 was also very interesting for MTU because of its pervasive use in military and other government applications. Long contracts for service, spareparts and follow-up orders. Big money for the shareholders.

    As Capt J said, the 8V 2000 as an propulsion engine in yachts is a very rare species. I also have never heard of one. But as a generator engine, the V8 2000 is quite common in the commercial world and in bigger yachts.

    We have a MTU 8V 2000 M51A, 315 KWe Generator as Nr. 3 Generator / Night Generator in the boat, as I do not like the radiator cooled emergency generator being used as a harbour / night gen. The two main gens are 12V 2000 M51A. Great combination.

    Due to the MTU modular system, if specifying the electrical demand of your boat, you end up with either V8, V10, V12, V16 or even V20 versions of the 2000 series.
  9. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

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    I didn't think the DDEC stuff was that high tech. Not worth buying a company.
    Picking up a solid engine company makes more sense.
  10. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    It was high tech for it's time and I believe they're still using the DDEC system today in pretty much it's invented form. Heck they've been using those really old looking displays on the new mtu's up until a few years ago.
  11. bayoubud

    bayoubud Senior Member

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    Looked at a sf boat 5/6 years ago in Jupiter and remember it had recent 1000hr service on series 60's at $24,000 cost. That seemed high and can't find an online schedule for maintenance to see what is required.
    Last edited: May 27, 2017
  12. bayoubud

    bayoubud Senior Member

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    Happened to see this http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/200...-2991829/Stuart/FL/United-States#.WeyPILpFzMQ powered by 8v2000 which was a concern by the original post. The only time I have seen this engine in a boat.
    The S60 was discussed here and I have a question about the DDEC electronics. Apparently the S60 is a good engine mechanically but my concern is the electronic components. A boat that we may look at has 2003 Detroit series 60 825 hp engines, which is before the mtu buyout. I have heard and read some bad comments about DDEC controls. Some where about the DD two stroke engines too. So, I am wondering if the electronics are troublesome and electronic parts are readily available? Also have read the current post here in this sub-forum about a 2000 m84 electronic problem.
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2017
  13. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    The DDEC controls for that ERA and earlier/later were made by Sturdy who also made all of the late model CAT and MTU controls (for shifting etc.). They are solid. The engine computer components I believe are the same ones and still being used. Only downside is the engines have A LOT of sensors and I more frequently see engine alarms of this sensor or that sensor on the displays. All sensors are available and aren't too expensive. I also don't like the engine displays as it's a pain to get to the function you want on the screen like LOAD or Fuel Burn and they just look old. But the S60 is a solid engine. They were getting 20,000 hours out of them in the cranes in the Port of Norfolk before rebuilds. However, I had leaking aftercooler issues on a 2003 825hp set with 200 hours on it and 2 years old at that time, that was covered under warranty. It was a Garrett aftercooler. They are not as torquey as cat's of the same era and HP, but ran smooth and quiet. Series 60s are NOT 2 strokes.

    The DDEC control issues were much much earlier...like version 2.0 or earlier.....early 90's..... but these were mostly a function of battery issues. They first ran the DDEC stuff off of 12 volts, but it drew a ton of amps at 12 volts, around 30 amps a motor. But if the controls were powered by the same bank (which most boat builders did at the time) as the engine it caused a lot of issues with voltage drops etc. I think DDEC 2.5 went to 24 volts and solved a lot of issues around 1994/5.
  14. bayoubud

    bayoubud Senior Member

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    Wow, a lot of current draw at 12 volts. So, any S60 should be 24 volt dc and a later version. Did read they made over a million of the s60's...most probably in trucks. I realize they are not two strokes but thought they might use the similar electronics. Still a lot of engines, so support should be good. Thanks for the info, the electronics on the modern engine has always been a concern, adds good benefits but another layer of complexity. Not to mention how quick electronic systems become obsolete with no parts or support.
  15. K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

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    Series 60's in trucks do not seem to be as reliable as they once were with the advent of all the emissions gear. I subscribe to a few engine groups where the S60 features almost as much a Maxxforce.
  16. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    WELLLLLLL, the MTU is still using the same electronics on their new motors. That is the entire reason they bought DD, just for the electronics that they then married to their engines and stopped building all of the DD 2 strokes, yet kept the S60 for much longer.....Parts have not been an issue for DDEC stuff.
  17. bayoubud

    bayoubud Senior Member

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    Capt J, good to know if considering a boat with MTU S60's. All I have heard about MTU is big $$ for parts and service, so like many have avoided them. See lots of big SF's and MY's with MTU's. Most boats that are powered with comparable 800 hp have Cat 3406's which most of us more familiar with. I have not seen a s60 maintenance schedule, so don't know what they require.
  18. PacBlue

    PacBlue Senior Member

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    The internet myth surrounding the DD / MTU purchase continues with comments like these.
    Firstly, MTU did not purchase Penske's DD, they formed a JV for two obvious needs. Penske had nothing on the horizon as the 2-strokes were being legislated out by emissions requirements. He potentially could have extended their life but had no marine R&D budget, as on-highway was king. The JV included a major MTU stakeholder called Daimler, who just happens to own DD as it exist today, EXCEPT for the off-highway market which is still under the MTU corporate umbrella.
    MTU had a small US footprint out of Sugarland, Texas and needed better access to the US markets. The Penske DD distributor network was cherished by many and eventually won by MTU. It was the only real bargaining chip he had and gave him a much needed cash infusion.
    There was no S60 military market then, but the production line was still building about 25% DD 2-cycle product for land defense programs worldwide.
    The S60 was not a controlling factor in the JV, Daimler grew bolder and eventually carved out the MTU DD business that was now sold to Rolls-Royce.
    DDEC was limited to In scope, saw some life on early S2000 Titan models, but MTU had their own MDEC going which has a further generation in ADEC. MTU was common rail focused for years and already had their own electronics/technology to do this work.
  19. bayoubud

    bayoubud Senior Member

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    Thanks for clearing up the status of the s60. Sounds a bit complicated with no real commitment to the DD s60 which is obsolete along with the DD 2-cycle. Sooner or later these obsolete engines will be abandon by parts suppliers. Would now be concerned about taking on a pair of marine s60's.
  20. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

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    We will long be unable to play with our own boats when the 2-strokes and Series 60/70s are not supported. I argue there are just to darn many of them in service.
    And there are less known and older motors out there still running well.

    I think we answered the original OP well. S60s are good motors.