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FOUND! Roamer 46

Discussion in 'Chris Craft Roamer Yacht' started by q240z, Dec 3, 2007.

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  1. q240z

    q240z New Member

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    We haven't yet broken the $64k mark, but it all depends on how you define "cruising." The boat will be capable of floating and moving under its own power by late spring, but we may not splash it until it's fully painted. It will be painted to the decks this summer. I'll begin in earnest on the interior this summer, though I'm working on bits and pieces now (e.g. extending the galley floor out to where the forward head used to be, etc) to give my aching back an occasional break from bottom work. I'm guessing we'll fully transition from our 52' Connie to the Roamer in 2010, and continue finishing things up while living aboard.

    A week or two ago I was under the boat applying filler and glanced down the length of the shiny hull. For the first time since beginning this project in 12/07, I was able to see light at the end of the tunnel. Regardless of how many boxes in the repair plan are checked off, that was the first time I realized the boat's only a few dozen hours from being able to move under its own power. I almost cried. :p
  2. K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

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    Hi,

    I wish you luck with getting her done and hope that you don't find anymore unforeseen things to delay or increase the scope of the project.

    Like any re fit I am sure you will be cruising and still have a number of jobs to be finished on your list- It happens on all boats , even those that have not had the level of TLC that this one has been subject to under your stewardship. :)
  3. q240z

    q240z New Member

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    "unforeseen things"

    HA! To tear a boat down more than I have this one would require taking it to the molecular level. I'm fairly sure I'm past the unforeseen stages, and let me tell you there have been a few. lol

    stay tuned...
  4. q240z

    q240z New Member

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    Winter came early this year and though it didn't snow much, it has kicked my 4$$ nonetheless. I lost a total of seven weekends this winter dealing with tent issues. The biggest lesson learned thus far is build your tent early, build it strong, ventilate it well, and keep lots of 4" shrinkwrap tape handy for when the 75mph wind storms come up and teach you who the real boss is.

    With all that said, I've been making progress:

    First, the rudders. Remember, they started out completely frozen and unwilling to budge, even with every lubricant known to man applied, heat, and a 12 ton ram.

    [​IMG]


    On the inside, there was no help.

    [​IMG]


    Eventually, it became clear that the best resolution was to simply cut them out.

    [​IMG]


    The stuffing box, where the aluminum log met bronze and the plain steel shaft ran up the middle, had turned to "unimetal."

    [​IMG]


    I got rid of all of the mechanical linkage and had a new rudder system built.

    [​IMG]

    I still need to install the spuds and hoses, but it appears this will work much better than the old gear.

    [​IMG]

    And they do look nice.

    [​IMG]
  5. q240z

    q240z New Member

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    I've also been busy fairing the topsides. Eight gallons of vinylester so far, and another five or so to go. My Azorean shipwright has promised the Admiral that there are four more work days before it's ready for paint. Brave man...

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]



    Also, for what it's worth, the following is the schedule I've adhered to for this boat.

    1) Sandblast to near white metal except where original fairing compound is in good condition.
    2) Alumaprep & Alodine to all exposed aluminum (possibly not necessary with appropriate "tooth" on the aluminum, but who wants to take a chance?)
    3) Three coats of Devoe 236 Bar Rust epoxy primer from the keel to a foot or so above the waterline.
    4) For underwater filler work, I recommend Interlux VC Watertight Epoxy Fairing Compound over Devoe 236. When applied within a few days after the last coat of 236, you get a fine chemical bond between the two epoxy products. The theory being that Devoe 236 flows much deeper into the pores of the metal than a paste filler can, yielding the best mechanical bond from aluminum to epoxy. Then, you have the outstanding epoxy-epoxy chemical bond from primer to Interlux filler.
    5) For above the waterline, I recommend LBI vinylester fairing compound in the 5-gallon pail. I was using 3M Premium Marine Vinylester, but one gallon of 3m is $88 wholesale and 5 gallons of BLI is $168 retail. They look the same, they smell the same, they spread the same, and they're both vinylester.
    6) Decks get the same treatment as below the waterline--Devoe 236 primer then Interlux VC filler.
    7) Finally, the whole thing will get three more coats of Devoe 236.

    Stay tuned.
  6. q240z

    q240z New Member

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    Since I can't figure out how to edit my post, allow me to make this correction:

    LBI vinylester fairing compound in the 5-gallon pail is fine for the first coat where you're going for maximum build, but 3M is a far superior product in terms of spreadability, density, etc. 3M all the way would be superior, I believe, but at substantially higher cost in materials. LBI's product tends to have many voids, which is very similar to the concrete-like high build fairing compound that was original to these mid-60s auminum Roamers. But since it doesn't spread as well as 3M, LBI's product may actually cost more in labor than the amount saved in material costs.
  7. 61c40

    61c40 Member

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    Great looking project ! May I suggest your rudder posts need to have a brass bearing area of a larger diameter sweatted sp [heated installed & then cooled] on to the stainless shafts to provide a bigger surface for your rudder bearing to wear on when your underweigh . What kind of upper carrier bearing and rudder packing gland did you end up with ?
  8. q240z

    q240z New Member

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    Hi, 61c40, and thanks for responding. It's good to know that somebody's looking. :p

    The delrin bushing for the rudder shaft is about 1/3 longer than the original configuration, which was a plain steel rudder shaft running through a schedule 40 aluminum pipe shaft log. I've been actively removing all brass, bronze, and everything else containing copper that isn't sheathed in plastic (aka wiring) from the boat, since there was pitting (sometimes severe) every place where Cu could find Al. What drives your recommendation to put brass on an aluminum boat? Does it have better wear properties than delrin? Do you reckon it would be worth the corrosion risk?

    The upper carrier bearing is a hole, sized in a slip-fit to the rudder, that is drilled in a 3/4" aluminum plate. This is the original configuration. I've not heard of these plates or the shafts wearing out, though if this one did I suppose I could machine up another delrin bushing for the upper plate. On this boat, there was no sign of wear in that area whatsoever.

    The packing gland is a standard bronze spud separated from the aluminum by a hose. Of course, the stainless shaft is isolated from the aluminum by the packing material and delrin bushing. All things considered, this setup seemed a reasonable trade-off though I would have ideally used a packing gland made from material that doesn't contain copper. Do you know of any mass manufactured spuds that aren't bronze? I looked, but couldn't find anything that's UL Marine listed.
  9. 61c40

    61c40 Member

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    There was a brass & rubber water lubricated bearing inside the rudder log on the original installation, a delrin bushing with a od slightly smaller than the id of the aluminum log will probably work . The upper bearing should be a rollar bearing large enough to carry the weight of the rudder and the up and down load . The rudders end up makeing alot of noise otherwise. good luck
  10. q240z

    q240z New Member

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    That's odd. The fabricator/marine engineer who made the replacements took a bandsaw to the original rudder logs after I cut them out of the boat. He claims to be using the sections as exhibits in a class he teaches on corrosion! lol But there was no brass and rubber cutlass bearing as you describe, only the steel shaft, the aluminum log, and the bronze nut with some very ugly packing material under it.

    On the rudder noise you mention with the original configuration, none of the other Roamer 46 owners I've talked to have mentioned that problem. Hopefully, one of them will chime in here with their observations. Did you witness this problem yourself on a 46' Roamer Riviera?
  11. acellist

    acellist Member

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    Rudder Noise

    I am confused as to what is meant by "rudder noise" since I cruised our 1968 46' Roamer down Lake St Clair into the Detroit River from our berth on the Clinton River to the marina (a trip of about 35 miles) where she was stored and repaired from Fall 2005 to Summer 2007. I heard no rudder noise at all (of course it's a mite difficult to hear much with twin 8V71Ns roaring at 1450 RPMs while cutting through a three foot chop breaking over the bow).
    During her time in storage the badly worn and loose rudder system was completely replaced with all newly manufactured equipment including new stainless steel rudders. We retrieved her from storage and refit in June of 2007 and after stopping for a month at her former marina on the Clinton River where new Radar installation, Depth Sounder installation, supply, and last minute repairs were performed along with a haul-out for a thorough bottom cleaning. We then continued on for twenty-six days through three lakes, seven more rivers, and thirty-two locks to our home port in Pittsburgh, PA, during which time I noticed no noise of any type from the rudders.
    I very much would like to know your meaning (is it a noise from astern, the helm station, or the master stateroom) simply in case anything of that nature should ever arise.
    Thanks

    (She looks Great q240z)
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2009
  12. q240z

    q240z New Member

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    Thanks, acellist!
  13. q240z

    q240z New Member

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    Winds and rain have been plaguing the project, but I'm still making progress...

    The aft stateroom is taking shape.

    [​IMG]


    I still have to replace the bulkhead, but the galley sole is now framed out. The stairs to the V berth will be on the left side.

    [​IMG]


    And I got the fairing squad from Weaver Boatworks making the boat straight. They'll also do the paint. If nothing out of the ordinary happens, it should be painted within a month or two, at least to the toe rail.

    [​IMG]


    It would go faster if they didn't have day jobs. lol Still, they do quality work.

    [​IMG]

    More to follow...
  14. q240z

    q240z New Member

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    Oh! Biggest finds so far:

    When your raw water strainer sight glasses break from ice damage (as the ones on this boat did) or get crazed enough to make you nervous, you have two options: buy the OEM cast acrylic replacements ($145 EACH from Groco) or talk to the nice people at http://www.coloredplastics.com. I picked up two feet of 4.5"OD 3/16" wall diameter cast acrylic tube, which is identical to the original stuff, for $56. That's more than enough to do the three sight glasses I have. Don't cheap out and go with extruded tube, since there's not much difference in price but cast is much stronger.

    Also, forget everything I said about 3M, Interlux, and LBI fairing compounds. My new supplier is jgreer.com. They are by far the best deal on resins, fairing compound additives, and cloth out there, and the quality is top notch. Interlux and 3M sand a bit easier, but the fairing crew is very impressed with jgreer's product. I've gone through 25 gallons of their fairing compound (32 gallons total, including the 3M and Interlux products that I used before) and will finish up this weekend with five more.

    We prime from the keel to the gunnel on Sunday!
  15. q240z

    q240z New Member

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    Oh, another big find if you're working on a metal boat: Lehigh Valley Abrasives. 40 grit Flap disks for $1.79 each.
  16. alloyed2sea

    alloyed2sea Moderator

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    Urnt,..

    ..., U gud!
    Have been sitting on pins & needles 4 awhile about thems sight glasses clouded up. Finally, a Roamer with some dollarsense.
    Let us know when she splashes down - u never no who may show up.
    Cheers!
    -E

    Attached Files:

  17. q240z

    q240z New Member

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    A photo from the future!!! What will stock prices be in August this year???

    Primer did not happen as planned. I had to order up another 10 gallons of fairing compound last week so the guys can wrap up the hull, but it didn't arrive by Friday. We dug into the interior instead, digging out the rotten plywood around the salon hatch and roughing out the galley bulkhead and front window surrounds. Interior work is sooo much more satisfying than prepping a hull for paint.

    And then, out of the blue, acellist showed up! All the way from Pittsburgh, PA to SoMD. It was excellent to talk to somebody who has the same year and model of boat.

    Pix to follow!
  18. q240z

    q240z New Member

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    Saturday morning, 5am. Dose of coffee, then left home in time to beat the Boatamalans to the Roamer. Slaved away until 11pm. Too tired to drive back home, I crashed on my buddy's boat. Michelob Porter is a worthy brew and lunch/dinner was three microwave burritos at 11:15--then I was out like a light.

    Sunday morning, 5:30. No freakin' coffee on by buddy's boat. Nuked the last burrito and got over to the boat before the Boatamalans. More slavin' until 6pm, at which time things looked kinda like this:

    [​IMG]

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    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]


    Yes, in fact, those are cutlass bearings. I've been waiting to install them until the epoxy was going on so I could coat the shell and the housing with plastic prior to install. Now, the only thing keeping me from installing the shafts is my day job. lol

    Two more coats of epoxy on the bottom and it gets bottom paint.

    Three more coats of high build, and the Boatamalans come back for final longboarding prior to topcoat to the gunnel.

    fwiw, the project's been going for one year and five months as of tomorrow.


    I am beat.
  19. revdcs

    revdcs Senior Member

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    "I am beat"

    But it's worth it though!

    She's looking good. Congratulations on what you have achieved so far.

    Are you planning on splashing her this year - or do you want her finished before she gets wet?
  20. q240z

    q240z New Member

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    Thanks, revdcs!

    I would like to splash the boat as soon as possible and finish the project in the water. The tent it's in (there are pix somewhere on this thread) has been very helpful, but not everyone appreciates...the aesthetic. In other words, it's ****ed ugly and the new owners of the boatyard want it gone. I told them it would be considered a hifalutin art form in New York, but they didn't see the humor. lol

    So, the exterior (at least to the gunnel) has got to be painted and the tent down before July 1. But once it's painted to the gunnel, I've still got a lot of interior work to do. Having hauled 12 sheets of 3/4" (19mm) phenolic faced, edge sealed plywood for the floors up the side of the boat and in through the salon hatch, I'm thinking it will be best to do the remainder of the refit with the boat floating at the dock. I would cry like a little girl if I damaged my paint hauling something aboard! :-0

    So, once the epoxy on the bottom is done, I'll toss the rudders and shafts in and apply bottom paint. The topcoat will be done concurrent with all of that. Then the tent comes down, the depth sounder thru-hull gets bedded, seacocks all set to the closed position and...it's splash time.

    That's the theory, anyway.
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