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Best Quality Brands of 5-20 years old used motor yachts 40-75 feet?

Discussion in 'General Yachting Discussion' started by Joe Deepwater, Feb 10, 2019.

  1. Silver Lining

    Silver Lining Member

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    Capt J I am not going to get into a contest with you. My wiring is all original and has been flawless. Although I did replace my 19 year old shore power cable. I do not know what poke and stick wiring under the dash is.

    I can check all fluids and change fuel and oil filters without removing anything but the engine room access hatch - I find this well thought out. I can role my carpet up and pull the center long hatch in about 5 minutes to gain access to most standard service items. To remove both aftercoolers for servicing I have to remove the small sofa on the port side and then the two large hatches come up giving nice stand up full engine room access on a 50 ft boat.
  2. Silver Lining

    Silver Lining Member

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    Because I think they (Sunseekers, Viking Sport Cruisers, Sea Ray, Ocean Alexander, Fairline, Neptunus, and Ferretti) all meet the OPs requirements for a larger flybridge, and most have open salons and pretty good windows for that vintage, nice swim platforms etc. My opinion is that most of these are also considered good sea boats for the type of boat under consideration. Those above are also generally well made, above average boats for that vintage.

    While a sport fish may be a better sea boat most of these wont meet his flybridge and swim platform requirements. I guess the Navigators and Carver Voyager perhaps would also fit his needs also but these have less deadrise than the British and Italian boats, so from a hull design perspective, my experience is that they are not quite as good in a head sea or dont track as well in following seas.
  3. Pascal

    Pascal Senior Member

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    I know MANs are normally reliable, the problem is the price of routine service, maintenance and parts. Two to three times the costs of Cat.
  4. ranger58sb

    ranger58sb Senior member

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    Lots of difference between 40' boats and 75' boats...

    But in any case, seems to me more useful to search out boats that offer the features you need/want/would like to have... and then worry about the rest later. Boats are often "systems of systems" and the engines, heads, AC, etc in any given brand of boat is likely to be the same (or equivalent) as those in any other given brand.

    Sport bridge, 3 staterooms, entertains 10... good start, and that may well narrow the field a lot anyway. Find those, then inspect for build quality, ACCESS to systems, condition (especially previous maintenance/service/etc.), walk-around-ability (??) -- within budget -- and then see what speaks to you and yours.

    -Chris
  5. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    The difference isn't nearly as much anymore if any in the costs when you figure that you have to replace the heat exchangers every 6 years on CATs (per Cat's recent mandate, and it is a necessity from what I've seen). It also really depends on how many hours a year you put on them as well. If you're doing a lot of hours a year, they're no more expensive than cats. In your situation, MANs would probably be cheaper as the oil change/service interval is every 400 hours versus 250 hours for Cat even though it is higher priced synthetic oil. I've noticed the Man's don't consume as much oil as cats in usage either and the MANs are slightly more fuel efficient in the same boat. Some things on Man's are expensive like sensors (water temp, oil pressure, etc.).

    Man's are just so much quieter, smoother, and fuel efficient over the cat's. I ran a new 70' princess recently with the new 1400hp man's, you couldn't hear the engines anywhere on the boat, not the FB, not the aft deck, not in the interior...….both at slow speeds and at 28 knot cruise. Cats are my preference in a lot of boats, but Mans aren't too terribly far behind them, and a much better fit in a lot of boats.
  6. Joe Deepwater

    Joe Deepwater Member

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    Stay away from the '09, '10, '11 years due to lower quality due to the recession? My 40 is a 2010 but the 496 Mags were built in '08, probably sat in creates for a few years, had an expensive recall (that wasn't officially a recall) where Mercruiser paid for the parts but I was forced to pay $2K for the labor. It seems manufacturers cut costs and that naturally hurt quality.
  7. bayoubud

    bayoubud Senior Member

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    Hard to get repairs and service in some areas. Definitely more expensive than Cat.
  8. Liam

    Liam Senior Member

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    From my experience Ferretti and Pershing have been the winners for Euro styled boats and production based builders. Never any problems in surveys and good boats to work on.
    Also engine room space is superior in most Ferretti and Pershing build up until 2010.
    All the rest go second behind them, including most American brands, again I am speaking for Eurostyled boats, so not putting a sportfisherman in the picture.

    For semi-custom then I would consider a Mangusta and Sanlorenzo above the rest, tough they have some delicate details here and there. which need attention.
  9. Joe Deepwater

    Joe Deepwater Member

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    How are Volvo diesels?
  10. Oscarvan

    Oscarvan Senior Member

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    Very good if (like any motor) maintained. But, parts are expensive.
  11. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    Parts are expensive. The other thing I've come across with Volvo's are strange issues once in a blue moon on one, that nobody could seem to solve. Had a set of TAMD's and all of a sudden the port engine would just overheat at cruising speeds. Several mechanics went through that motor, and nobody really did pinpoint why it overheated. I remember we did heat exchangers, thermostats, the entire coolant system.....and on and on.
  12. bayoubud

    bayoubud Senior Member

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    Fished with a buddy that had older Volvo TAMD's , they would overheat every summer when the GOM heated up. The cooling system was not adequate for water temps in the upper 80's. He spent a lot of $$ trying to fix but finally sold the boat.
  13. Oscarvan

    Oscarvan Senior Member

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    The cooling system was installed by the boat builder who may or may not have built to spec.... Not necessarily Volvo's fault or they would ALL be overheating.
  14. bayoubud

    bayoubud Senior Member

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    It was a 28/29' Topaz...best I remember those boats did ok in on Atlantic areas where temps were cooler than the gulf. Don't think it was install but HE was not adequate. Other wise the engines did well... we fished the heck out of that boat...it was a billfish magnet...plus I think we ran over everything that was floating. lol
  15. Liam

    Liam Senior Member

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    The problem with most Volvo's before the D common rail series was introduced are tappet valves which needs to be serviced by the book every 200 hours.
    Kad44, Kad300, Tamd74, Tamd75.

    Now many owners or mechanics decide to skip this since the tappets on a Tamd75 cost about 1k to do. Also the first generation D9 575hp also had tappet valves if I remember correctly.

    Now if you do not the tappets at 200 eh nothing will happen, at 400 same, but at 800 engine hours or beyond they usually crack a head.
  16. Joe Deepwater

    Joe Deepwater Member

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    I just returned from the Miami Yacht Show where Leopard was selling new powercats with aggessive pricing. 51 foot with 25 foot beam 4 BR for $879K new seems hard to beat. We assumed they were used at first based on the displayed price, so I asked the salesman how many hours were on the engines. He said they were new 2019s, but they truly were basic white fiberglass and gelcoat nearly everywhere. But one could add custom designed cushions and color schemes at those prices. 51 feet, 25 foot beam, massive salon and flybridge, 4 Queen/double bedrooms, plus one layout included 1 more single bed extended into the bow points on each pontoon for a total of sleeps 10, not including the sofa lounge or table in the salon. THoughts?
  17. gr8trn

    gr8trn Senior Member

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    That is a lot of boat. Leopard built in S. Africa? I think their sailing cats are certainly decent and well received. This trend for big power cats is beyond my experience. I am sure there are plenty for charter now, that would be the way to tell what your thoughts are.

    Motion of a Cat is a different animal too.
  18. bayoubud

    bayoubud Senior Member

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    A lot of room on those beamy Cats but harder to find dockage with that 25' beam. That is a lot of new fiberglass for $879k.
  19. ranger58sb

    ranger58sb Senior member

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    Seems like a fairly enthusiastic price for that size/new, but I haven't really been following that market recently. Leopard has a good rep in sailing cats, as far as I know.

    Did that include typical options like genset, AC, laundry, etc.? Questions about what options are available and/or included would likely be useful to pin down. Charter owners might expect use in the Islands, maybe or maybe not AC or genset installed, etc... whereas puttering around in South FL in July, especially when docked, is sometimes a different ballgame.

    We've shopped on cats before. Mostly decided a queen berth stuck in between the hull -- no walk-around space on either side -- sucks... so that'd strike many models off our possibles list. Also, we preferred "owners" models; we don't need all that extra sleeping space, don't want to encourage guests, etc... so we'd prefer extra space in the hulls instead be other useful functions (study/den, laundry, workshop, storage, better access for system maintenance, etc.)

    -Chris
  20. Joe Deepwater

    Joe Deepwater Member

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    One or two people at the show said pods have their issues and not worth the fuel efficiency in larger boats. Most boats with pods that I toured at the show were Volvo.

    How are John Deere diesels?