Click for Nordhavn Click for Mag Bay Click for Nordhavn Click for Westport Click for Cheoy Lee

Another case of Italian boats impracticality

Discussion in 'General Yachting Discussion' started by Pascal, Jan 4, 2021.

  1. gr8trn

    gr8trn Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2012
    Messages:
    464
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    I don't think Euro styling is the most dangerous thing about boating, I think boarding a tender or runabout is about as dangerous as it gets.
    As many have indicated, it is incumbent on the host/captain/mate or whomever to ensure safe boarding. Simple really.
    Now, non skid surfaces to step on are a brilliant idea. I just had a friend crack his ribs and get a shiner falling from his deck house into the companionway of his sailboat while on the hard doing paint prep. He knows where the slippery bits are.
    Boats are slippery.
  2. Pascal

    Pascal Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2008
    Messages:
    6,312
    Location:
    Miami, FL
    Reality check. Guests need to be able to get on and off a boat safely without requiring assistance or a hand unless they have special needs (age, etc..)

    Captains and crews are usually busy doing a variety of tasks. Sure in a perfect world you d have a couple of extra crew but then boats have limited crew quarters. In our case, at 84 it s just three of us. No room for a 4th crew. We re all busy so guests need to be able to get on and off when at the dock. We can’t station someone at the stairs. Self leveling stairs are safe enough and can be used on just about any boat as long as the builder added a boarding gate. It s not difficult or costly to install at the factory...

    The point of my post was to attract attention to these issues and educate new owners who may visit this forum. Nothing more. No boat is perfect and yes US builders are not immune to stupid flaws.
  3. olderboater

    olderboater Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2013
    Messages:
    6,631
    Location:
    Fort Lauderdale
    The point of your post then remains valid, but as to Reality.

    Boat is sitting at the dock and guests are loading or unloading. That should be the number one priority of the crew. All those other things you say they're doing can either be done before or after. You can station someone at the stairs. You should station someone at a boarding gate. Guests should never be allowed to board or un-board unattended. Owners, regulars, perhaps, but not those you're referring to. But even owners and regulars should not be doing it alone without someone else observing. Two many people fall in the water doing the simplest things at the dock and hit their heads on the way down.
  4. Pascal

    Pascal Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2008
    Messages:
    6,312
    Location:
    Miami, FL
    Again there is the real world and there is Lala land

    We were docked at Staniel 3 days ago. I m in the ER doing stuff... first mate is at the office checking in... second mate / stew is busy preparing for lunch. Guests decide to go check out the bar. I don’t have a 4th crew to station at the top of the stairs to assist the guests who don’t need any assistance going down boarding stairs with grab rails

    I can’t even believe I have to explain this. Even on larger boats next to us, guests get on and off on their own when the boat is set up so boarding is safe. No crew stationed at the gate
  5. mapism

    mapism Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2008
    Messages:
    1,241
    Location:
    Sardinia
    In this form, your point is one I can only agree with - wholeheartedly.
    That's not what transpired from the title, though.
  6. mapism

    mapism Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2008
    Messages:
    1,241
    Location:
    Sardinia
    Yup, as I think you know, that's something I'm also well aware by now, and never argued with that.
    I would just be surprised if at their HQs they wouldn't be aware of that, and already working on improvements of some sort, because it's clearly unacceptable for a worldwide market leader (not only in pleasure boat industry, but also in any other field!) to not give the US market the attention it deserves.

    Also because let's not forget that these are the same folks who last summer splashed hull #1 of Benetti Oasis series (easily googlable, for anyone not aware of it), sold to a US chap, btw.
    And the last time I heard, already some months ago, how many of the next slots they already sold, the count was already up to 14.
    Can anyone name another 130+ feet & 20+ millions boat anywhere near that, in the whole history of pleasure boat industry?
    I mean, this ain't a game where the shareholders can allow a poor dealer to waste their reputation. Not for long, anyhow.
  7. gr8trn

    gr8trn Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2012
    Messages:
    464
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    Reality check, said guests had already been onboard and had been briefed on the safe boarding and disembarking of said boat. Or, they get no briefing and fended for themselves.
    That's fine to. Your choice.

    I guess it depends on the guests. I don't assume my guests are versed in the perils of boarding safely. Neither did the skipper in your original example. Why is that so out of touch with reality?

    I, like you, am posting for those who are curious as to different approaches towards safe boarding.

    I have no room for a boarding step without hand holds or grip for footing. Not saying that is okay at all, just that boats with such lack of easy boarding should entail a safe boarding chat and demonstration and assistance if needed.
  8. olderboater

    olderboater Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2013
    Messages:
    6,631
    Location:
    Fort Lauderdale
    I'm not sure Azimut knows beyond the fact their US sales are very good and they don't have to deal with any of the problems. I keep hoping.

    As to the Oasis, beautiful boat but 80' of boat and 50' of rear deck. Ok, slightly exaggerating but it's unlike any boat I've ever seen in many ways. As Arte Johnson would say, Very Interesting.
  9. mapism

    mapism Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2008
    Messages:
    1,241
    Location:
    Sardinia
    I see your point, and don't disagree - also because I haven't seen Rebeca in flesh - though a few folks I spoke with who did, were stunned.
    Still, having actually closed 14 contracts within weeks from the boat presentation (and a few of them actually even earlier), for a boat of this size, is something no other builder have ever experienced before.
    So, obviously there are buyers out there who found the concept "interesting" enough to literally put their money where their mouth is!
  10. olderboater

    olderboater Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2013
    Messages:
    6,631
    Location:
    Fort Lauderdale
    Oh, if I was in the market, I'd definitely have talked to them.
  11. Oscarvan

    Oscarvan Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2015
    Messages:
    933
    Location:
    Chesapeake Bay
    There are a large variety of boats built on on both sides of the pond. Pick one that suits you, there's something for everyone. And for the record, ease of boarding is high on my list. But as someone pointed out that's not the case for everyone. So the buyers get what they want. And we get to watch and laugh at the gymnastics. There is no point in ranting against what other people like. Unless you are a pro captain having to move one, you don't need to deal with it. And in that case you make it happen, that's why you're the pro. Oooooohm.
  12. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2005
    Messages:
    13,757
    Location:
    Fort Lauderdale
    That's not true. I once ran a 62' Predator to Bimini for the day. We docked bow in and 90% of the boat was in the slip. The tide came up to where only 3 of the 4 of us could get on the boat. I had to get someone in a RIB to pick up the last guess at the ladder stairs (in case someone fell off the docks) and bring the person to the swim platform so she could board our boat. It was beyond embaressing for her.
  13. NYCAP123

    NYCAP123 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2008
    Messages:
    11,228
    Location:
    Long Island, NY
    So what's not true and what's embarrassing about boarding from a dink?:confused: You dealt with it. I once had to carry a girl in a skin tight miniskirt and another time a guy in a wheel chair down a ladder to a boat. Both started with feeling defeated and embarrassed and finished feeling like superstars. You deal with it.
  14. Brian G

    Brian G Member

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2016
    Messages:
    52
    Location:
    Nashville, TN
    FWIW, the European market might be bit larger than the US market. In a 2019 Business Insider article that tallies the number of yachts over 80' residing in various countries, the US has the top spot with 158 yachts but the next 4 countries are European (Italy with 133, Spain with 133, France with 118 and Greece with 82) for a grand total of 466 Euro vessels. Thus, if these numbers are accurate and indicative, the European market might be three times as large as the US market. This could explain why European builders might be reluctant to adapt their designs too much for a smaller US market.

    But then again, I'm driving an Asian yacht with an Italian name (Bella Roma) in the inland waterways of Tennessee ... so what do I know!
  15. Danvilletim

    Danvilletim Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2011
    Messages:
    726
    Location:
    isleton, ca
    Oasis is definitely on point with the success that San Lorenzo is having with their similar design.
  16. Pascal

    Pascal Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 29, 2008
    Messages:
    6,312
    Location:
    Miami, FL
    having run a sister ship to your J70, one of the things I loved about it is that there was always a safe way to get on board Regardless of tide ..: either at the boarding gate, the swim platform or the SS plate behind the stern cleats. And it had a non skid treatment!!! I guess Taiwan builders understood the US market :)
  17. Brian G

    Brian G Member

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2016
    Messages:
    52
    Location:
    Nashville, TN
    There are a lot of things I love about this boat. That's just one of them. :)