Click for Nordhavn Click for Walker Click for Apolonnian Click for Northern Lights Click for Apollonian

Air-Electric Drive System

Discussion in 'Technical Discussion' started by TRY, Oct 23, 2006.

You need to be registered and signed in to view this content.
  1. MaxResolution

    MaxResolution Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2007
    Messages:
    159
    Location:
    Little Rock
    Tah!

    Tah! = There you have it!

    Ta-Ta = Eat your hearts out!

    Rat-a-tat-tat- tah-ta-dah = Too bad, yanks,-
    here's another manufacturing job that an American was "unwilling" to do.
    :p
  2. The Reverend

    The Reverend New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2007
    Messages:
    55
    Location:
    La Paz Mexico
    Still Waiting For Hard Facts

    What are the details of this agreement will they actually manufacture anything?
    I have spent some time checking this project and in MHO the numbers do not add up!
    I have yet to see anything special about what is basically an air compressor running in reverse with a slightly unusual crank and some electronics.

    If we could turn some of the hot air we have seen generated about this machine into energy then we would really have something worth talking about.:)
  3. TSI AV

    TSI AV Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2006
    Messages:
    104
    Location:
    Estonia
    Let me quess...

    Hi, everyone.

    Sorry, TRY, I had to use one of Your pictures ...
    So, let's think ...


    1. Compressed air is stored in vessel, marked as 1. As mentioned, 300 bars.
    2. Then it is led through air reducer (mark 2). I assume, that You reduce it till 30-35 bars...
    3. Then, through the solenoid (mark 3). It can be of a directional or propotional action. I think, propotional (to regulate air flow).
    Guys, this is "right pedal" (in cars).
    Or, another version, this is a powerful heater...
    4. Position 4. Probably there are two pistons on one connecting rod ?
    But for sure, double expansion is used (cylinders have different diameters).
    5. Pos. 5. Honestly, I am not sure. It can be a temperature sensor or a shaft's angle magnetic detector ?
    6. Positions 6. Wow. This motor has multiple PTO shafts. Or, or ..... may be even this is a motor without conrod (in this case all these wheels are used for kinematic schema).....? Or, (again) or, such kinematic is used to "delay"
    pistons at TDC... ?
    7. Very interesting "piece". Rotating damper ? Air vane motor ? Cooler / fan ?

    8. And whole unit is placed on a heater (that white box) ?

    Guys, sorry for too many ORs, MAY BEs, PROBABLYs.

    TRY, please confirm / decline my expectations...

    P.S. For those, who still did not get it...
    If You have ever seen diesel engine, starting on compressed air ?
    Imagine, that there is a lot of compressed air, what is efficiently used...
    But diesel engine will not have fuel system at all. It will turn only on air...

    But some problems to solve:
    1. Compressing the air. Solved. (Use ENVIROMENTALY clean electricity to drive compressors).
    2. Storage of big amounts of compressed air with such pressure (300 bars).
    (That is why TRY reports us "usage in not big applications). Partially solved.
    3. Effective usage of compressed air. TRY already mentioned some ways to do so. Well, ideas are still welcome !

    TRY, please reply...

    Best regards,
    Andrei

    Attached Files:

    • YF1.jpg
      YF1.jpg
      File size:
      56 KB
      Views:
      489
  4. MaxResolution

    MaxResolution Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2007
    Messages:
    159
    Location:
    Little Rock
    OK, now I'm the skeptic!

    I don't want to say too much, but this thing looks suspiciously like a conventional motor. Why all the bother?

    Maybe I should practice reverse engineering, revisit that book; "In search of excellence." ...Book a bloody trip on "the Hovercraft," ...or 'Try' out for a role on "the Apprentice." Surely I've missed my calling.
  5. MaxResolution

    MaxResolution Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2007
    Messages:
    159
    Location:
    Little Rock
    The Di Pietro Solution

    Can I interest you in an all sealed, stainless construction, ultra-light, vibrationless, low-noise, multi in-line, hot-swapable, direct-drive, 10-year *replacement* guaranteed, infinitately scalable solution?

    http://www.engineair.com.au/airmotor.htm
    (Sorry, I can't attach images from this mac, because the differences are astounding.)
  6. K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2005
    Messages:
    7,384
    Location:
    My Office
    Hi,

    MaxRes- You posted that link in Post #57, What's changed since you first posted it?

    Good Questions Andrei, There are more unanswered than answered questions here with this what another poster refers to as "miracle" we see displayed before us.TRY as he has said twice in this thread is a shareholder in the company that builds these, with this statement I can only assume he is not a member of the design or engineering team. This may be one reason why he doesn't answer many of the questions posed, preferring to post another promotional item instead.
  7. The Reverend

    The Reverend New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2007
    Messages:
    55
    Location:
    La Paz Mexico
  8. MaxResolution

    MaxResolution Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2007
    Messages:
    159
    Location:
    Little Rock
    purrrrr

    What's changed? My perspective. Actually I was hoping to insert that image because not everyone will click an outbound link, and the comparison is astounding. Here I thought I was dealing with the stone age, and yet I use this as an exlimplary study in -basic- mechanics. Why, it still needs that silly hose attached.

    Wiki is lots of fun, but who has the time to scour the World Book. I've got 250 unchecked links on the free energy forums I need to attend to first, not to mention all the Mfg. boat sites.
  9. K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2005
    Messages:
    7,384
    Location:
    My Office
    Hi,

    MaxRes- Here are a few images off the site so everyone who wants to can see if they are interestd enough to click the links you provided.

    Attached Files:

  10. TRY

    TRY Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2004
    Messages:
    282
    Location:
    cannes
    Apologies to everyone!

    I've been very busy lately with our new venture, but I promise to reply to all (interesting) questions and remarks before the end of this weekend.
  11. MaxResolution

    MaxResolution Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2007
    Messages:
    159
    Location:
    Little Rock
    Check out the disclaimer

    I love the banner atop your Wiki link. Can't quote it exactly, (that was yesterday,) but something to the effect that this technology remains debatably to be proven. I think we all just love fancy pictures, James Bond cars and sleek trophy 'models' to go with them. :)

    Try,we're just having fun at your expense. I am proud to see anyone eager to push the envelope.
  12. K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2005
    Messages:
    7,384
    Location:
    My Office
    Hi,

    Do you mean this disclaimer?

    Attached Files:

  13. TRY

    TRY Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2004
    Messages:
    282
    Location:
    cannes
    2500+

    Who would ever have thought that a dull and purely technical thread would ever make 2500?
    Who would ever have thought that four more "alternative propulsion" threads would have followed up?
    "Diesel electric" was first, I agree, but that's not a fully non-fossile fuel solution.
    "Solar power" - "fuel cells" and "gas from water" are completely new approaches to the general and marine propulsion solutions, as is our "compressed-air" engine.

    It is very encouraging to see that an increasing number of ideas are being developed by an increasing number of people to overcome the fossile-fuel-dependence of motive powers.

    Keep up the good spirits and we'll definitely get there!
  14. TRY

    TRY Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2004
    Messages:
    282
    Location:
    cannes
    Recap and replies

    First, I would like to remind you that this thread started off as an informative action, just to let all of you know that alternative solutions were being worked on, and we do not at all suggest or think that we're the only ones!

    Therefore I will reply to questions which go this way of thinking, not to provocative and questioning or dubitative remarks (I still don't understand what American football had to do with this topic).

    Andrei - (TSI-AV) - summed up a number of fair questions in his reply #83:

    1 =correct
    2 = correct
    3 = correct
    4: no, in the photograph it's a two cylinder engine of 600cc, with normal same-size piston cylinders, and the compressed air delivers its power in a single expansion step.
    5 = negative
    6= negative
    7: this part of the unit is the electric generator (220VAC) pack. It serves as an alternator (in a car), as a starter motor, or as the compressor drive when feeded with 220VAC.
    8: no, this is just the support plate of the sound damping case. We don't need a cooling system since no heat is developed.

    Andrei is correct in saying that this engine is only as clean as the electric power it uses to replenish its tanks.
    A major advantage is that the engine is ZERO pollution where and when in use to drive.... whatever (car - genset - forklift - industrial tow tractor - boat).
    This, plus its modest volume and weight, opens a lot of new applications.

    Effectiveness and power range are being further developed (petrol and diesel engines started life as a small, single cylinder, low power unit).

    For the various applications as mentioned above, industrialisation is now in final stages and series production may start somewhere in early 2008.

    The main opposition does not come, as many think, from the fact that the Seven Sisters will eventually kill it. No, because even in full swing the numbers of these units will be insignificantly small compared to fossile fueled engines.

    The fact that "air" is not a taxable commoditiy may lead to some opposition!

    Furhter questions and enquiries of seriously interested parties will be answered via private messages.

    All general information will be available very soon on the re-newed site of www.mdi.lu.
    I will continue to act as the marketing interface.

    Thanks to all for your symphatetic support.
  15. K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2005
    Messages:
    7,384
    Location:
    My Office
    Hi,

    TRY- The above statement made by on Thursday last week had me believing that we would finally be getting some answers to some of the questions about this too good to be true revolutionary new engine.

    It was a little dissappointing to see that all you have managed to produce to fulfill this pledge other than another post praising yourself for having started a thread which has attracted so many views is to answer the questions posed by a very switched on YF Member which in reality is little more than a glorified parts list.

    If you can't answer some of the questions that I am sure not only myself but a number of other subscribers to the Forum would like to have answered maybe you could pass them on to some of your colleagues in the engineering department of the company and revert with the answers that way.

    I look forward to your response with interest.
  16. jdpeterson

    jdpeterson New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2005
    Messages:
    36
    Location:
    Fort Myers, Florida
    The de Pietro (Oops, didn't realize that I didn't get a new window when I hit reply so I could refer to the actual text, so I appologize if I've mispelled the target.:eek: ) vaguely reminds me os the Wankel engine with the three pointed rotor that Masda used quite a few years ago. Had a 2nd cousin in California that put 150,000 miles on her her's.
  17. MaxResolution

    MaxResolution Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2007
    Messages:
    159
    Location:
    Little Rock
    Yes, but

    Every savvy Ozzie knows about the 'Orbital Engine.' This involved a spherical piston. As she begins to move, she rolls head over heel, but as you achieve speed, it slips to a horizontal axis, thus serving as a gyro-stabilizer for the vehicle. (No trim levelers required.) Not only did it get 100mpg, but the afterburn was an inherent portion of its operating principle, so less exhaust. Lastly, the inventor had a very clever direct-transmission, giving it tremendous torque on demand. (Collision,...Mayday?) But, rather than compliment the line-up at Holden, she sits covered in dust on the shelves at Ford Motors. (Hari-kari?, Roll-over? ENRON?):mad:
  18. TRY

    TRY Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2004
    Messages:
    282
    Location:
    cannes
    To re-activate

    I thought I'd bring a bit new life in this story.
    After all, life begins at 3000 views, or amI wrong?

    We have now available for short-term use in a marine environment:
    - 6 kw generator - engine 10 kw - weight 60 kgs - dimensions 0.6 x 0.6 x 1.0 meters
    - 12 kw generator - engine 24 kw - weight 90 kgs - dimensions 1.0 x 0.6 x 1.0 meters

    Since no cooling is needed, no marinisation is needed.
    Since exhaust is clean air, put it anywhere (no holes in hull needed).

    I guess (factual planning of the development team) that a 200 kw engine (or genset) will be available in 18 months to 2 year.

    Not of interest to this community, but just as an information: industrial applications now comprise a 5 tons tow-tractor and a 1 ton forklift.
    With the forklift we use compressed air to push the load up, we return it to the tank when the load (or empty chariot) comes back down!

    So, everyone is again up to date.
  19. redmax

    redmax New Member

    Joined:
    May 10, 2007
    Messages:
    1
    Location:
    breskens
    Electrical power driven propulsion

    Hi,

    Would you please be so kind to let me know if in the mean time you have any experience in electrical power driven propulsions?

    I'am building a new light (10 ton) fast offshore sailboat.

    It would be great if I could install just a powerfull enough genset to be able to supply some 40 kw power and still strong enough to supply ample power for the rest of my electrics and electronic systems.

    Thanks for advice,

    Red Max
  20. TRY

    TRY Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2004
    Messages:
    282
    Location:
    cannes
    Goede morgen Red Max in Breskens

    Ik zou hier ook in het Nederlands kunnen antwoorden, maar dan verstaan de anderen er niets van ....


    Sorry for this short internmezzo in Dutch, I'll continue in English.

    We can supply in about 6-8 months the gensets for propulsion and domestic appliances, either as one single unit or as a dual system - 2 sets.

    2 sets have the advantage of weight and volume, seemingly important on your lightweight saling boat.

    I am in the final stages of a licence agreement in Holland and I will put you in direct contact after signature.

    Please send me a private message with your coordinates.
    Good luck with the build of your new toy!!