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$2.00 Gas ?

Discussion in 'General Yachting Discussion' started by GordMay, Mar 30, 2004.

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  1. Capt. G

    Capt. G New Member

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    Ensenada, Baja California
    Mexico will soon offer low cost diesel to visiting yachts.

    Just heard that by November, Mexico will allow pleasure boats visiting here to buy fuel at the commercial fishing fleet price. This was just voted by the congress here.

    At the same time you will only have to clear into Mexico once and once clearing out. No more port by port paperwork!

    Regards

    Graham
  2. brian eiland

    brian eiland Senior Member

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    Expensive Trip to Bermuda

    I was commenting on the new "MITseaAH" recently and thought this fuel notation might be applicable in this subject thread:

    "Please excuse me just a moment while I digress to consider the fuel needs of these big engines. The owner looks forward to trips from Long Island, NY and Newport, RI to Bermuda. I believe it has been estimated that MITseaAh will burn about 60 % of her fuel load on this 25kt dash out the 630 miles from Newport to Bermuda. That works out to about 122,400 gal or about 200 gal/mile. At an average approaching $3.5 per gal (between here and Bermuda) this trip will run about $428K per one way trip. "
  3. schnibbelfitz

    schnibbelfitz Senior Member

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    Location:
    Mannheim, Germany
    Hey everybody,
    another post talked about "red fuel". So, please explain this quickly to me. How many different types of fuel are we talking about? Red, Green, White, Gasoline? Sound like the Italian tricolore flag! :D

    Can gas turbines burn "regular" fuel? Which type?

    Regards,
    Olli
  4. brian eiland

    brian eiland Senior Member

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    $66 per barrel today

    I wonder what the fuel cost in Europe are this summer??

    I'm certainly receiving a lot of web surfers looking at motorsailers.
  5. Codger

    Codger YF Wisdom Dept.

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    Western Canada
    $1.34 US per litre in Naples early last week. =$5.07 US per US Gallon.
    This was for diesel at the dock. Much less if purchased duty free.
  6. Garry Hartshorn

    Garry Hartshorn Senior Member

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    Location:
    Directly above the center of the earth
    Get used to it

    Currently we are paying $3.90 to $4.00 in Australia
  7. Kevin

    Kevin YF Moderator

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    Canadian fuel prices are getting up too. :( Diesel is roughly $3.15/gallon (US$)
  8. brian eiland

    brian eiland Senior Member

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    ...this little discussion from a 'Passagemaker Under Power forum....

    Fuel & Prices & Cash vs Credit Cards

    We purchased fuel 7 times on "Legrace". Last year after breaking in the
    engine by running hard up and down the IJsselmeer we bought fuel for the
    first time in Stavoren, NL. at a gas station that serviced cars on one side
    of the pumps and boats on the other. They had the best prices in the area
    0.813 Euros/Liter ($3.78/gal). But they would only accept cash or a Dutch
    bank debit card. That is typical in the Netherlands when buying fuel at
    marinas or bunker ships.

    Our next fuel purchase was in Liege Belgium. Belgium has the some of the
    best fuel prices for boats because you can buy un-taxed red diesel. We
    bought #2 Diesel for 0.425 Euro/Liter ($1.98/gal). The bunker ship accepted
    Dutch bank debit card.

    Along the French canals and some rivers, fuel can be hard to find and
    expensive. Sometimes the charter companies will have a fuel pump for
    servicing their boats and in a pinch will sell to other boaters. Many times
    the sail boaters will lug jerry cans back & forth from local gas stations
    but that is not an option for us when buying 600 or 800 liters.

    Over the winter we bought fuel twice in Valence at 1.02 Euros/liter
    ($4.75/gal) and they accepted all major credit cards. Just before we left
    Valence this past spring we topped up, at 0.99 Euros/liter ($4.61/gal).

    >From our past cruising on the Seine River, we knew there were bunker ships
    servicing barges but most of them only had un-taxed red diesel which is
    illegal for pleasure boats France. There is a bunker ship at St Mammes on
    the Seine, that sells "white" diesel in addition to red for the barges.
    Fortunately I asked the day before we planned to buy fuel about price and
    method of payment; 1.14 Euro/liter ($5.31/gal) and cash only! Lynn commented
    later that was probably our biggest cash purchase ever - we cut off the pump
    at 530 Euros.

    Our last purchase was in Dover, UK. (also red un-taxed diesel - legal for
    boats) £0.40/liter ($2.76/gal) and all major credit cards accepted.

    More Later,

    Bob & Lynn Williamson
    MV Legrace
    Aquanaut Drifter 1250 AK
  9. Codger

    Codger YF Wisdom Dept.

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    White or undyed fuel is tax in. Dyed fuel is tax out fuel. Depending on the country dyed fuel is for commercial use only, sometimes for fishing fleets only. Get caught in a vessel when it isn't permitted, with dyed fuel in the wrong jurisdiction and the fines can be quite painful. If you purchase fuel in a port where it's legal for your vessel then make sure that you get a receipt specifying date, type and quantity. It doesn't happen that often but the authorities can decide to check the fuel on board and get nasty
    Green fuel can be a specific grade of gasoline. Red or sometimes purple gasoline indicates tax out although there is probably somewhere on this planet where those colours indicate something else.
    Turbines should run on a narrow cut fuel which is closer to what is called Kerosene or white gas again depending on where you are. Some installations can be run on a narrow cut clean diesel. If you think that there is lots of room for confusion you are absolutely correct. Always check the fuel sample before loading it.
    Just remembered another one. Blue is usually avgas.
  10. CTdave

    CTdave Senior Member

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    I just paid $3.38 a gallon for diesel here in Connecticut. This is getting out of hand
  11. Remy

    Remy New Member

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    Location:
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    In France, 1.17 € per litre for petrole, and 1.07 € per litre for gasole... :eek: :eek: :eek:

    Definitely worth to own a pedalo... :rolleyes:
  12. Kevin

    Kevin YF Moderator

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    It's certainly a good time to start looking at blow-boats I'd think. :)
  13. brian eiland

    brian eiland Senior Member

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    Motor Oil Prices

    Thought this comment from a another forum was interesting as related to this new world of fuel prices.

    "As a side comment, it has been impossible to find high spec motor oil - like API CH-4 or CI-4 or ACEA E4 or E5 specs. I once saw Shell Rotella at a bunker ship and have kicked myself for not buying it. Also motor oil is very expensive compared to the US, 4 to 6 Euros per liter ($18 to $27 a gal) and I have done a lot of shopping in auto parts stores and discount stores.
    Consequently I have been using Volvo Penta 15w-40 motor oil (API CF-4 / ACEA
    E3 spec) in the John Deere since it is the highest spec oil I can find consistently."
  14. brian eiland

    brian eiland Senior Member

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    What it Buys

    Amazing what $2.55 a gallon gas can buy, isn't it?
    Wait 'til you see this.


    .....to be continued

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  15. brian eiland

    brian eiland Senior Member

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    What it Buys (continued)

    .....continued

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  16. brian eiland

    brian eiland Senior Member

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    What it Buys

    In case you're wondering where this hotel is, it isn't a hotel at all. It is a house!

    It's owned by the family of Sheikh Zayed bin Sultan Al Nahyan, the former president of the United Arab Emirates and ruler of Abu-Dhabi.

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  17. lucidog

    lucidog New Member

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    Location:
    I don't know yet...Central California Coast
    3.00 Calif. Central Coast!

    I pay 3:00 in California Central Coast. But then again, the non-marina pricing is nearing fast. Oh, and I went to Reno and paid 3.01...that's just chump pricing!
  18. brian eiland

    brian eiland Senior Member

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    I think we Americans have to accept some responsiblity ourselves. We have long ignored what the experts were telling us about long term fuel supplies. We continued to ignore conservation measures, and as the far biggest user in the world have brought some of the 'sudden rise' upon ourselves as we waited till the last minute.

    In this same vien we continue this lack of foresight even today. Look at this energy bill (finally!!) that all of Congress is patting themselves on the back for. It hardly contains ANY conservation measures....just handouts to the oil companies that are already making record profits from the increases in fuel prices. Lets keep that in mind at the next election.

    And we as concerned citizens need to let our elected officials know that we are willing to accept some pain for TRULY intelligent energy policy rather than political policy they continue to pass.

    I worked in the oil sector in SE Asia for a few years back in the late nineties. We could see looming problems then, and particularly the coming Chinese situation (now #2 user, surpassing Japan). And watch out, shortly China will feel threatened with being cut off from world fuel supplies like occurred with Japan before WWII. They may likely get REAL aggressive about any energy fines near their territory (such as all of the Spratly Islands).

    And we have yet to learn how to intelligently negioate with the Chinese (true bartering combined with 'saving face'). No, we are foolishly tided up in another country.

    Our motor vehicles are by far the biggest user of fuel. Why don't we really have a new nation policy on improving their efficiency. We put a man on the moon long ago.....don't you believe that if we made a REAL committment we could attack the problem with some of that brain power and funds we spend on a multitute of weapon's development and get this job done?? I'm not saying stop weapons spending....just stop some of the foolish spending such as that 'extra' nuclear aircraft carrier that even the navy didn't see a need for, nor those fuel tanker planes that are not obsolete. nor this obsolete and non-operable missile crap in Alaska, nor the F22 that may be so complicated it won't fly half the time, etc, etc. Put some of this brain power and wasted funds to work on a real important problem.

    Think of what this new auto technology (or better yet, electrical energy stowage technology) would mean for our economy, both here in our own country, as well as an export item to the world. Sure would be nice to have that image again. Wake up America!! you've been snoozing too long
  19. Codger

    Codger YF Wisdom Dept.

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    Brian: Well stated.

    I am, err, involved in the oil patch. That being said, I do understand very well that petroleum is a finite resource. The costs of bringing the product to market are increasing, the cheap, easy stuff is gone. I don't even want to get in to the subject of overstated reserves! I would agree strongly with your take on China and the potential for conflict.
    I have a little Smart car for running around the city. Admittedly I bought it simply because I enjoy efficient machinery as much as anything else. Much of the time I travel using a small aircraft that burns less than 10GPH just on the shy side of 200 knots. Yes, I do have a couple of toys that can **** fuel at prodigious rates but they don't see that much activity. :-(
    Looking forward, security and availability of supply are major issues, no matter on a national basis or bunkering a yacht in many areas of the world. Mr. Abramovich may feel secure enough in ongoing access to his fuel requirements to start another project that won't hit the water for 3 or 4 years but I'm not in his league.
    There are renewables being developed that should be transparent replacements for diesel. Methyl Esters as one example currently being used by the US military in some applications.
    Getting a hard answer from the marine powerplant manufacturers on compatability has been frustrating to say the least.
  20. brian eiland

    brian eiland Senior Member

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    Trade Report

    The ripple effects of Hurricane Katrina’s destruction in the Mississippi River basin already are making themselves felt in the U.S. economy, particularly in fuel prices, which are expected to quickly spike at more than $3 a gallon at the pumps.

    “The trading market yesterday went into orbit,” says Jerry Nessenson, president of Valvtect Marine Fuel, which supplies 500 marinas with its special blend of fuel.
    Nessenson says prices in the Gulf Coast states since Friday went up $1.20 a gallon, to a wholesale price of $3.05 a gallon for unleaded. Prices in New York City were up 60 cents a gallon to $2.45. Nessenson predicts prices at the automotive pumps will reach around $3.50 a gallon, and marine prices will top $4 a gallon.

    Supply is also a concern. Nessenson says oil companies are rationing supplies to distributors, which is causing shortages to consumers in some areas. Marinas are particularly hard hit, he says, because marine fuel is a lower priority. The shortages are particularly acute in the Gulf regions, obviously, but Florida is also is feeling the pinch. Nessenson says some of his marina customers are alerting boaters with slip reservations this weekend that fuel supplies will be limited.

    “It’s a tough sign of things to come,” says Nessenson, who adds that he personally knows boaters who have cancelled voyages planned for this Labor Day weekend.

    The hurricane, which rolled into Louisiana Monday and ripped across Alabama and Mississippi, halted oil production in the Gulf of Mexico where a third of the nation’s domestic oil is produced. Platforms were evacuated, refineries were shuttered and a major oil import terminal was closed.

    Refineries in the Gulf Coast area supply finished fuel products to nearly all distributors east of the Rockies, says Nessenson.


    It may be weeks before the full extent of the damage at facilities is determined. It takes several days for a refinery to start up production again. Power outages will likely add to the delays, and analysts say it could be months before production returns to pre-storm levels.

    The Louisiana Offshore Oil Port, which was evacuated Sunday, appears to have suffered no significant damage, according to a report by the Department of Energy issued Tuesday afternoon. But the biggest hurdle in restarting operations is in restoring electrical power.

    Offshore platforms have been hard hit. The Coast Guard, which has been surveying damage with representatives of the petroleum industry, says at least five drilling rigs are missing, seven are adrift and two are listing.

    Hurricane Ivan in 2004 led to an estimated loss of nearly 44 million barrels of oil production between September 2004 and February 2005, according to Aon Corp., a risk management service.

    Federal officials today say they plan to tap into the nation’s oil reserves to help refiners. Energy Secretary Samuel Bodman, in a televised interview, said the government later today will make an official announcement but that officials are prepared to loan refiners barrels of crude.

    Shortly after Bodman’s comments, crude oil prices fell 26 cents, to $69.55, around 9 a.m.

    Nessenson says tapping into the reserves will help assuage fears, but that the bigger problem is the ability of the refineries to produce enough fuel. Even before the storm, refineries were struggling to keep pace with demand for finished fuel products.

    “A car or a boat can’t burn crude oil,” says Nessenson.

    — JoAnn W. Goddard

    j.goddard@tradeonlytoday.com
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