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Something wrong with 53 or 56 voyager?

Discussion in 'Carver Yacht' started by offshore1, Aug 9, 2012.

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  1. offshore1

    offshore1 New Member

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    We didn't mention anything about Symbols or older Hamptons.
    Any issues with either of these cruising East Coast or Bahamas ?
    ocean Alexanders seem to be the most expensive boats in the 15-20 yr old range.
  2. Pascal

    Pascal Senior Member

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    A yacht fish or more recent cockpit MY may be the way to go.

    Keep it mind that Hatteras have fiberglass tanks, heavy copper plumbing and solid glass hulls... A big plus! Wait till you have to pull the engines to replace corroded tanks on Carvers or Taiwan boats!

    Build quality matters. Other builders come to mind like Viking
  3. sam356

    sam356 Member

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    Owning a 50 footer or bigger is a big expense diesel engines 2 generators up to 5 air conditioners and many more items. If somethings goes wrong in the ocean you would need to fly a person in to repair so you can continue on your trips. It does not matter what yacht you buy. I give you lots of credit to do this but the cost can be high. Even if you have a 100' yacht the ocean will bounce you around like you had a row boat. Maybe you should take cruises on a ocean liner and not worry about anything. You can take alot of cruises for $600,000. If it going to be just you and your wife on the the yacht you going to buy ,I would thing you would need 2 deck hands to help you out in doing things around your yacht.
  4. Pascal

    Pascal Senior Member

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    2 crews to help a couple run a 50 footer???

    What repairs "in the ocean"? The OP is talking about he east coast and bahamas...
  5. chesapeake46

    chesapeake46 Senior Member

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    Lets see....

    A ship full of people I don't know going where the SHIPS captain says


    or


    A 50 footer with me & my little wife going where WE want to go.

    Even if we don't have the range or capacity of the cruise liner,
    I choose the "we two" option.
    hat4349 likes this.
  6. sam356

    sam356 Member

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    I am a little confuse Pascal do you charter your hatteras with a crew or does your wife and you do it all by your self.sandBARhopper Also when you are on the east coast like Miami that is the alantic ocean. To go to the bahamas you are in the ocean. Like a 125 miles away. I know you do not like carvers or any other boat but a hatteras but guess what your wrong there is a lot of good boats out there hatteras is just one.
  7. Savasa

    Savasa Senior Member

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    Bahamas are only 42 miles from Flt. Lauderdale. My wife and I run our 46' Cheoy Lee by ourselves and I think we could comfortably handle a 50' vessel.
  8. offshore1

    offshore1 New Member

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    My wife and I wil run the boat ourselves.
    Remember, we are talking about 6-8 months cruising the East Coast, Florida and Bahamas.
    54-56 foot raised pilothouse motoryacht.
    I'll have bow and stern thruster for ease of handling.
    We don't have kids or grandkids so no need to sit at home.
    My dream would be to buy a;
    OA, Offshore, Hatt, Symbol or Tollycraft or similiar ( don't know anything about Sonship or Novatech ). No Carver or Navigator or Sea Ray.
    54-56 foot raised pilothouse motor yacht ( cabin midship ).
    2 cabin 2 head preference.
    1994 - 2000.
    able to cruise at 20mph if desired.
    bow and stern thruster.
    freshwater would be the ultimate.
    pucchased reasonably so i can update electronics, AC compressors, pumps, impellers and galley without getting killed down the line on resale.
    purchase in the $375,000 - $400,000 range and then invest $75,000 in upgrades and spares.
    We are both 65 yrs old and have owned 9 boats. We feel completely comfortable cruising. 30 yrs ago we ran a 25 foot Formula from Chicago to Chatanooga Tenn and back in 2 weeks. That was before we knew better.
  9. Pascal

    Pascal Senior Member

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    You are obviously confused about MANY things...


    First it s a 42 nm crossing to Bimini, and just invade you are equally confused a out Nautical Miles that is about 48 miles. Hardly a long run

    Next Crewing requirements on charters are very different from private use. I don't charter on my own boat. On the boat I run (70' Johnson) i would never operate without one crew so that guests can be taken care of, especially in an emergency. But as private boat it different ball game and most owners will run their own boat. In fact the previous owner of the 70 used to run the boat with is wife and no crew.

    It comes down to personal preference.. Some owners like to be on their own, have their privacy and run their own boats.

    And obviously you are equally confused about my taste in boats...my view, which inve made clear many times, is that you need to buy the boat that suits your needs, and your needs only. Nothing wrong with a carver or even a bayliner if you are going to stay in Protected waters or pick a good window for a Bahamas trip.
  10. sam356

    sam356 Member

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    Ok Pascal I give you that you know your stuff if I had the money this is got everythiing Offshore needs except stern thruster but you have twin engines which you can make her walk sideways.
  11. jhall767

    jhall767 Senior Member

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    You seem to have a good idea of what you want. What do you anticipate will be your annual repair/replacement costs? Do you hope the $75k upfront will be enough to carry you for several years? I'm thinking $150k would be a more realistic number for a mechanical systems refit. Or more likely $30-50K per year on that size boat. Remember the three most expensive words in boating are "might as well".
  12. Pascal

    Pascal Senior Member

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    Stern thrusters are really not needed on twin diesels as you get excellent response with gears... Throw one in reverse and the other one in fwd and the stern will move sideways. It takes very little practice to be able to move the stern a few inches backing into a slip for instance.

    The most important item when it comes to ease of handling is not a stern thruster ( or fancy joystick control) it s being close to your spring line (pilot house doors at the lower helm) and aft deck deck engine controls for backing into a slip

    Looking at this Hatt, The deal killer for me, and many..., Is the lack of an aft deck. When anchored out, or even at the dock, we spend most of our time on the act deck and I think Hatteras dropped the ball in the late 80s and 90s by reducing the aft deck to nothing more than a balcony. Even on the last of the classic MY (early 2000s) you barely have enough room for a table and 4 chairs.

    This is especially true in the Bahamas... You want to be outside enjoying the view, the breeze, etc... Not inside the saloon...

    That said, that Hargrave design sharp bow will cut thru 6 footers like butter

    Compromise compromise
  13. offshore1

    offshore1 New Member

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    Jhall
    The $75000 up front will be for electronics, pumps, impellers, interior stuff.
    I'm not planning on gen and main end rebuilds but estimate main rebuilds at $25000 each when needed.
    That's why someone needs to buy the boat and a reduced price.
    The original owner is missing all these costs. I find that in most cases, that's the main reason he is selling. All these costs are right around the corner for him.
    So again, how can one pay top dollar for 15-20 yr old boats and be expected to absorb all these pending expenses if he wants a reliable cruising boat to live on 6-8 months a year ?
  14. jhall767

    jhall767 Senior Member

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    From what I've seen there are many 15-20 year old boats out there where the bulk of the equipment is in "still-working" condition. Or it just hasn't broken yet. A friend of mine looked at a similar boat to what you are looking for and noticed the owner was living in the forward cabin. Turned out that as stuff broke in the other cabins the owner just moved his stuff into a different cabin. Finally ran out of boat and needed to sell.

    I don't think there is a difference in REAL value between a 15 year old boat and a 25-30 year old boat that both have been maintained in like condition. I'd take a look at some of the well built and well maintained older boats. They will probably have had some of that equipment replaced already.

    Given your running speed requirements (52ft boat 20 knots) I do think your estimate on the cost of rebuilding a main engine is way too low. A 671TI can cost $25K to rebuild and I don't think a pair of them are going to push a 52ft boat at 20 knots.
  15. RB480

    RB480 Senior Member

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    So a Carver Voyager isn't capable of crossing a 42 mile stretch or harbor hopping up the east coast?

    News to me.
  16. sam356

    sam356 Member

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    I met someone who has a 352 silverton aft cabin who travels from sassafrass river MD to Florida every year. He did it for 5 years with gas engines it cost him about $5000 every trip. He maintain his engines and just did regular maintaince to it. I like the 57' carver voyager I would take one over a hatteras any day. I seen asking price for a 2003 voyager for $420,000 with 250 hours on them with all options.
  17. Pascal

    Pascal Senior Member

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    I don't think anybody said that...
  18. offshore1

    offshore1 New Member

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    Correct
    We were just comparing the ride fit anf finish.
    A heavy OA or Offshore is certainly going to ride better than a 53 Voyager.
    carver made those boats with a flatter bottom for more speed without regard to rolling at anchore in the Bahamas.
  19. offshore1

    offshore1 New Member

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    Jhall
    25MPH not knots.
    my friend has a 57 jefferson with 820's and cruises at 22 MPH.
    Yes rebuilds are expensive and thats the vise I'm in.
    Try to buy older cheaper and rebuild ?
    or try to pay a " little " more and try to avoid rebuilds.
  20. DanM

    DanM New Member

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    Pascal, it’s been some time since you and I conversed, back when you were posting pictures standing on the side of a dingy you were building and selling.

    All things being equal and including quality upkeep, where do you start to get concerned about hours of diesel and gas engines. Engines being factory stock. No rebuilds and yes, I know a survey and oil analysis would tell a lot but give me your gut feel. Do you have a preference of brand? I have my own opinions but I am your summer weekend, casual, do his own maintenance boater. You deliver and captain a multitude of vessels year round.

    Thanks