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False Creek Follies...

Discussion in 'Marinas & Waypoints' started by Ward, Jan 15, 2019.

  1. Ward

    Ward Senior Member

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    I work at one of the marinas in False Creek. There are no bouys in False Creek and (almost) no super-yachts at any of the marinas. There are a couple yachts at Quayside Marina on the north side of the Creek that are probably large enough to be called super-yachts, but I've never seen them (or any other super-yacht) at anchor.

    What we do have is an endless problem with people who buy crappy boats (I've posted a couple pics in the rogues thread) and want to anchor in the Creek permanently. That got to be a huge problem and the city of Vancouver worked out a complex deal with Transport Canada (the federal gov't body responsible for waterways) that allows the city to regulate anchoring and try to limit how long people can stay at anchor.
  2. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

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    Many popular places in Florida, the state kicked (and removed) out all the anchored boats and installed mooring balls.
    The Ball Cops enforce time on the ball and over $20 a night. Will not let you anchor near the mooring field either.
    Many years after this was started In St.Augustine FL I still have mixed feelings over this.
    The tourist do not see any derelict boats downtown. It's turned into a heck of a money income.
    Oh the stinkers and sinkers are just south of town now and scattered out in other placed but still there.
    So what was really improved or regulated?

    BTW; Smile when you say crappy :) boats.

    Capt Ralph Crapps :D
  3. olderboater

    olderboater Senior Member

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    I'd call it a few popular places rather than many, but that's simply a matter of debating definition. I'd say it's worked out very well in the ones I've been to, especially St. Augustine. The mooring field there is very good and well served by the marina. Daily rates are from $6 to $23 with very attractive weekly, monthly and annual rates. Those who have used the mooring fields are extremely positive toward them. Plenty of anchorages remain a short distance away, just not right on top of the marina.
  4. Ward

    Ward Senior Member

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    I'm curious what other places do about people with so-so boats who anchor in "nice" areas of a city.

    False Creek in Vancouver is a very protected area right in the middle of the city. On the north side of the creek is downtown, on the south side is a busy shopping/commercial/political (City Hall) area. 40 years ago, False Creek was mostly surrounded by industrial sites and no one would want to anchor there. ~30 years ago, the whole area started to get cleaner and more residential. House/apartment prices in the city have been sky-high for years, and about 20 years ago people realized that they could live on a boat cheaply and anchoring in False Creek put them right in the heart of the city for a fraction of the cost of buying a place.

    Waterways in Canada are the responsibility of the federal government, so when the number of sneakaboards got out of hand, the feds passed some laws and regulations that allowed them to delegate some authority to the city to regulate anchoring in False Creek. It's ended up being a joint operation of the Vancouver Police (who were given the authority to issue tickets and direction notices - "you must move your boat out of the creek") and one of the marinas run by the city (who are the people who can check boats at anchor).

    [Side note: not just out of hand in terms of looking like hell, but a few boats sank or washed up on the shore, even though False Creek is very protected. The cost of cleanup is less than the cost of running the anchor management program.]

    In order to anchor in False Creek, you're supposed to apply for a free permit (online or at the marina office) and you're allowed to stay 14 days out of 30. After 14 days you're supposed to go somewhere else. If you don't, the police can issue a direction notice and - eventually - your boat can be impounded. But the wheels of enforcement turn very slowly, so someone who's determined to flout the rules can drag things out for much longer.

    I've read about similar issues in other places (I've picked up a few Latitude 38s recently so I've been reading about the same issue in San Francisco), but I'm curious who other jurisdictions deal with the issue.
  5. dennismc

    dennismc Senior Member

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    If a vessel is not capable of being in a safe navigation condition it should be regarded as either a liveaboard vessel or removed from the waterway. as our Coast Guard is an sar outfit and located with many vessels within The Creek it can do annual inspections as to safety, anchored vessels who may be suspect and cannot show a valid inspection certificate, tag and tow. will soon put a stop to the nonsense.
  6. Ward

    Ward Senior Member

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    Maybe the CG can do that in theory, but in practice they've said they won't. They will respond to a situation where there is imminent danger e.g. during one of the windy days this past summer, they came and towed a sailboat to safety that was dragging. OTOH, they refused to do anything about a less dangerous case when another sailboat was banging into the seawall in Spyglass after dragging in much lighter winds.
  7. dennismc

    dennismc Senior Member

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    city Hall and Ottawa can, if they wish, circumvent any concerns the CG may have, 99% of the time they sit around doing whatever, that base in False Creek is a political event for votes only, what a farce, have the resources do not use them. If our cars require insurance in order to legally park in City lots I don't see the valid reasons for the authorities not to have these powers to enforce anchorage regs.
  8. Ward

    Ward Senior Member

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    Oh yeah, it's a totally solvable problem, but no one wants to touch it. Probably the only reason the current system works at all is that the city staff "on the ground" who currently run the program are pretty dedicated to doing what they can. From what I can tell, they're not totally unsupported by higher-ups, but it's not a high priority.

    One (very small) thing the CG did that do I approve of is they've still got one of the Garden-designed "Post" (the Atlin Post) vessels at the station, apparently still somewhat in use.
  9. Ward

    Ward Senior Member

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    This was orignially posted in the "Rogues" thread, I think it makes more sense here (and it's just a link to the pic already on the YF server, so it's not using any more storage).

    This is one of the lovely boats that tend to show up in False Creek when the anchoring restrictions aren't enforced (this picture is from last summer):

    [​IMG]
  10. Ward

    Ward Senior Member

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    Here's another collection of iffy boats from last month (Feb 2020):

    _20200210_082136_rs.jpg

    Last summer, the coast guard almost did something about the old Chris Craft, they were threatening to seize it as a hazard, but in the end they just pumped all the oil/gas/whatever out of the bilges and washed their hands of it. I love the fact that the guy's jet ski doesn't work, so he's paddling it.

    The guy who owns the sailboat flotilla has been around with the Sunstar 28 (closer to the camera) for a few years. He acquired the green boat sometime in January, but it didn't last long:

    sailboat-1.jpg

    https://www.vancouverisawesome.com/...-washed-up-on-sunset-beach-for-a-week-2145396
  11. Ward

    Ward Senior Member

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    Last one for now... This Cal 25 has been around the Creek for a couple years, the picture is from Nov 2019. Since these guys (almost all are guys, but there are a few women) don't have money, they have to make do with whatever they can find for an anchor.

    _IMG_0275_rs.jpg
  12. PacBlue

    PacBlue Senior Member

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    Well, those old Cal sailboats have a nice flat deck to mount some hideous structures to. Their downfall has been no standing headroom, can you imagine living aboard in a permanent "crouch" position. I imagine most of those flat decks have various stages of rotting core as well.
  13. Ward

    Ward Senior Member

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    I should ask to get this thread re-titled "Carnage in False Creek" or "False Creek Follies..." Here's a compilation of the latest goings-on:

    One of the guys constantly violating the anchoring restrictions had an old Fraser 30 sailboat. One day it just sank right off of the Maritime Museum. It sat for a couple weeks with the mast sticking up, then one of the other constant anchor violators tried to pull it by the mast, which snapped. The city finally paid to have it hauled in and taken away.

    IMG_0275.jpg IMG_0276.jpg

    Less than a week after that was removed, an old Grampian 26 that was a new boat in the Creek, but owned by a frequent anchor violator burned to the water.

    Yellow_G26.jpg

    I heard about emails between the VPD, the City employee in charge of waterside structures and the Coast Guard, all agreeing the CG should act fast and get it hauled away before it sank. But the CG only wants to get involved if there's a hydrocarbon risk and those all burned away, so at first they weren't interested. Of course it sank, and is now waiting to be removed, with just the burnt top of the mast showing. A burnt cushion had floated in to the seawall yesterday...

    Yesterday there was a pretty big windstorm at the same time as the tide was low, so a couple people were blown towards shore and grounded. The sailboat is probably a visiting boater and looked ok when it floated off later in the day. The powerboat is owned by another of the constant anchor violators, but he has another crappy old boat and was back and forth keeping an eye on this one.

    34680E8F-AF17-4027-8BE4-5383DF6549F0.jpeg

    This last picture is from a couple of weeks ago, included for the irony:

    130F2E2D-1B60-46C3-AA55-C51A6622A345.jpeg
  14. Ward

    Ward Senior Member

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    This is why it's worth it for jurisdictions that have crappy boats anchored out to spend the money to seize them, haul them away and dispose of them :

    Before:

    IMG_1155_rs.jpg

    After:

    IMG_1230_rs.jpg

    I haven't tracked down the full story on what happened to Bodicea, one old guy I was talking to on the seawall said it washed up on the rocks, then there was a fire, then it sank. We've had a cycle of a very high low tide during the day so when I was having a look from the water today, it was too deep.
  15. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    I agree with this. Also, the iffy boats are much less likely to break free and hit other boats when on a mooring ball. Don't have to worry about anchor dragging, etc.
  16. Pascal

    Pascal Senior Member

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    That s across the fairway behind my boat. The power boat is an old bayliner that s been sunken there for about 5 months... previously it had been washed ashore on the other side of the spoil island and towed. The massless sailboat arrived a month ago... there are a few more sunken within half a mile. Every few months the county or state sends a barge to pick up the trash and crush it in dumpsters.

    that small floating dock used to have an aluminum ramp to access the spoil island... it was dislodged 3 1/2 years ago during Irma and is rotting half sunken behind the wreck. Never repaired. BDFB6339-D7DE-4387-86E1-90D55FBFA060.jpeg
  17. Ward

    Ward Senior Member

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