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Engine question

Discussion in 'Carver Yacht' started by hopper5, Nov 23, 2013.

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  1. hopper5

    hopper5 Member

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    After removing and replacing a leaky coolant tank on my Carver 440 (Cat 3116) I noticed the temperature higher on that engine. I added the 1 1/2 gallons of coolant that came out while removing the tank and ran the motor for a couple of minutes without the cap to get any air out of the system. Is it possible I have an air bubble ?? Is there a way to bleed the system other than leaving the cap off for a period of time?? Always Something !! Thanks in advance for any thoughts..........
  2. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    Not really. Check it after it cools off and put more water/coolant in. I would've changed the coolant while I was at it. It is also entirely possible you have a much deeper issue such as a leaking aftercooler causing exhaust gasses to get into the coolant and causing excess pressure making the tank leak, which would also make the engine run hotter.
  3. K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

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    Hi,

    CaptJ, Are you sure the after cooler is Jacket Water cooled?

    Could you also please enlighten me as to how exhaust gas passes through it?

    If you had enough exhaust gas pressure to overcome the coolant pressure you would be lucky if the engine was still running.
  4. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    3116 aftercoolers are coolant cooled. They have had lots of issues with them.

    Boost pressure is higher on the 3116, than coolant pressure. So it's entirely possible the aftercooler is leaking and getting turbo boost into the coolant side.
  5. K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

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    Hi,

    I was under the impression it was sea water causing the Cgarge Air Cooler problems, tubes failed and sea water entered the engine.

    Boost Air is not exhaust gas.
  6. hopper5

    hopper5 Member

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    Thanks for the info.........The engine temp was fine until I removed and replaced the coolant tank. The radiator repair shop found a faulty seam in the tank and soldered it for the repair. I don't know anything about after cooler gases.........It sure is a learning process !!!!! Anything else I should check??
  7. NYCAP123

    NYCAP123 Senior Member

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    Yes. Being a simple guy let me go to the most simple possibility. If a piece of solder dripped or broke off it could easily have passed through the system damaging the impeller.
  8. hopper5

    hopper5 Member

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    I am not a mechanic as you can tell.......but wouldn't the impeller be for the seawater vs coolant ??.........the tank I had repaired was the coolant tank and not the heat exchanger.......
  9. NYCAP123

    NYCAP123 Senior Member

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    I'm not a mechanic either, so we'll let the mechanics chime in on that one. I should know but I'm having a brain fart at the moment. (Long night) I believe on a freshwater cooled motor the waterpump and impeller are on the freshwater side, and the sea water is pushed through by compression, heat and exhaust.
  10. NYCAP123

    NYCAP123 Senior Member

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    OK, brain fart is over. Right you are. Sorry.
  11. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    It could just be that it has air in the system as well. Check the level of the coolant again and see if you need to top it off.
  12. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

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    On a closed coolant system, with the proper cap on the expansion tank (radiator cap) and the recovery bottle full of coolant, the system should self purge after a few warm up/cool down cycles. Keep a good eye on this recovery bottle. It is a signal if not operating correctly or at all.
    What are your temp readings? Really overheating or getting nice and warm?
    Any coolant loss noticed? keep using the recovery bottle to replenish (if working correctly) and not use the expansion tank cap.
    In history, I remember coolant spilled on a loose belt. Pulleys slipped and the alternator did not charge. Check your belts. Maybe a pump pulley not up to speed.
    Pressure test the system, Pump up to 8psi max, let sit several hours. If it's down, find the cause.
    Sometimes when you fix one thing, Murphy (domino effect) gets involved and the next weak item fails.

    Keep us up on every small detail,
    rc
  13. K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

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    Ed,

    There will normally be a pump for each even on the old Detriots in your current ride.

    The Jabsco type thing hanging off the back will do the Sea Water and the Coolant one will be mounted at front of the engine and probably be belt driven.
  14. hopper5

    hopper5 Member

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    Thanks so much for all of the replies. I am going to the boat tomorrow and try a couple of things. I did have one thought...reaching for straws !!.........The engine that was much cooler is routed through the hot water heater which is off now.......meaning the water in it is cold........since it is essentially another heat exchanger is it possible it would run 15 degrees cooler until the hot water tank water was hot ?? I thought I would try turning the switch for the hot water tank on tomorrow , let it heat up for an hour or so then start both engines and see what happens to the temp on both engines...........that sure would be nice and easy if that was the issue !!!!!!!!!
  15. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

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    So, the suspect engine is NOT overheating? Just suddenly running a little warmer?
    I am confused with your last statement about a water heater. What engine is suspect, what temp was it running at, what temp is it running at now, under what conditions is the engine running to draw your concerns, is this the engine with the water heater?
  16. K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

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    Hi,

    If you find that the engine that is cooler warms up when the HW Heater is on this will point directly to the thermostat on this engine being stuck open and it not allowing the coolant to get up to temp in the engine.

    FWIW, It is a somewhat a waste of time to keep posting that one is warmer and one is cooler expecting some magical answer unless you can include the actual temperatures or at least the temperature differential ( how many degrees between the cool and the hotter one) if the actual numbers are classified information.:D
  17. hopper5

    hopper5 Member

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    I am going to run them today and will post the difference in temps. If my memory serves me.......the "warmer" engine was running about 170 vs 150 for the cooler engine.......this is at the dock . obviously with no load. As far as the thermostat on the "cooler" engine that flows through the hot water tank.....does anything flow through the HW tank before the thermostat opens ?? If it doesn't then they should both heat up at the same rate to the same temp......correct ?? Thanks for the patience..........
  18. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    It could have a blockage somewhere. It could be on the raw water side. It could be fine, you need to run it at cruise rpms under load and see what the temps are. Some coolant will flow through the motor even if the thermostats are closed....otherwise you'd get hot pockets in some area's of the motor.
  19. hopper5

    hopper5 Member

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    I ran the engines last weekend at the dock......no load. I let them idle for about 45 minutes......it took that long to get the temps up to operating temp. The suspect engine went to 170 and stabilized. The other engine went to about 155 and stabilized. The cooler engine is the one that runs through the hot water tank. The line going to the HW tank was warm after about 5 minutes of run time so that tells me the water coolant circulates through the HW tank before the thermostat opens. The HW still wasn't hot at the sinks after 45 minutes and I ran out of time to keep going. My thought is that the HW tank is keeping the engine about 15 degrees cooler .......I need to run the boat under load to get the temps up to normal on both motors...which I assume will happen after the hot water gets hot......The water in Puget sound is pretty chilly right now so at idle at the dock it takes forever to get them heated up. Does this make sense?? My only thought is if the thermostat is working correctly on the "cooler" motor......they did purr lime kittens by the way !! Thanks again for any input !!
  20. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    On most engines (not electronic diesels) they will never get to operating temperature while tied to the dock. When the water temp gets to 130F-140F you're fine to untie and leave the dock. At that point I'd stay under 1200rpms till they come up some more in temp to around 155F and then slowly bring them up.