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Electronic engine controls: good or bad?

Discussion in 'General Yachting Discussion' started by motoryachtlover, Nov 6, 2020.

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  1. motoryachtlover

    motoryachtlover Senior Member

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    On my 95 54 Viking I have the hynautic engine controls. They have always been a little stiff and now one of the throttles is a little spongy at full WOT. I am having my favorite mechanic doing the 1000 hour service and he installs the electronic controls and if I were going to go electronic he recommends Glendenning. If I convert now I save the money I would be spending on having Glendenning service/rebuild the synchronizer. My main/only objections to the electronic controls is the lightning issue and the malfunction issue. What are the forums thoughts on this decision? Also Glendenning offers a backup system that would probably cost 5000 installed but would take up more space in the engine room. If one were to go electronic would the forum members recommend the backup. Thanks very much for your time.
  2. Danvilletim

    Danvilletim Senior Member

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    Always end up costing a lot more.
  3. Soulstice

    Soulstice Member

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    The previous owner of my boat did the glendenning upgrade a few years before I bought. I know he said it was a bit more expensive than he expected. He installed it as he had a close call docking with the cable system. He also installed a comprehensive lightening grounding system for the boat with discharge spikes on the hardtop.

    I personally like electronic shifters as I have had them on my last two boats. Regarding backups, many gears have a backup shifter on them that can be manually actuated in the engine room. Not ideal for docking but they will get you close to home for a tow.
  4. mapism

    mapism Senior Member

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    Retrofitting electronic controls on non-electronic engines is a pet peeve of mine, for two reasons.

    First, they don't fully replace the mechanical controls, neither for the engine governor nor for the gearbox. They rather introduce an additional layer of complexity - i.e. other malfunction possibilities - to a system that remains mechanical. In other words, instead of moving levers at the helm which directly push/pull other levers on the engines and gearboxes, you move levers that send electronic signals to a blackbox, which in turn controls some actuators, which eventually move the very same governor and gearbox levers as before. And if that sounds complicated, well, it's because it is.
    Secondly, I like better separate levers for throttle and gearbox, but this is of course a personal preference.

    Bottom line, in your boots I would stick to the hynautic stuff, but I'd have them serviced by someone very familiar with them.
    And I would also save any money on the synchronizer, by simply getting rid of it.
    I'm well aware that analogue tachos aren't accurate enough for engines sync, but the beauty of twin diesels is that you can do that just by ear - it's simply a matter of knowing what to listen for.
    If you mind any harmonic noise, and fine tune the throttles till it disappears, you'll run them as aligned as with the most sophisticated synchronizer.

    All that said, Glendinning controls are pretty solid, and while my personal preference would be for Kobelt, if you decide to downgrade to electronic controls, there's nothing wrong with Glendinning.
    Besides, if your mechanic is already familiar with them, it wouldn't be a good idea to twist his arm into anything else anyway.
  5. Pascal

    Pascal Senior Member

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    I m not a big fan of electronic controls. Too many things that can go wrong at the wrong moment.

    On medium size boats, say up to 60/65, You can’t beat cable controls even with dual stations. Simple and you get plenty of warnings if something starts getting loose... they just don’t feel right.

    On boats with a second station, they still work fine.
  6. mapism

    mapism Senior Member

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    I couldn't agree more.
    But if the hynautic controls the OP mentioned are the ones I have in mind, they are a very different animal vs. the Teleflex/Morse cable controls.
    Hydraulically operated, with an air expansion tank in the e/room and actuators pushing/pulling the governor and gearbox levers.
    They used to be a sort of "higher end" choice, back in the days of mechanical engines, compared to mechanical cables.
    And they were indeed very solid and well built. As I recall, they also allowed a third station, as opposed to cables which can only handle two.
    That said, on a '95 boat, it's not surprising that they should be serviced/tuned...
    They are nowhere near as simple as cable controls, though.
    Hence my previous suggestion to look for someone who already knows them well.
  7. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    I've had the end fall off of the engine with cable controls several times throughout the years........one time, thank God I was in the ocean because was cruising along at 25 knots in a 35' SF express and the throttle cable fell off of one engine and boat hooked a very hard turn.......
  8. cleanslate

    cleanslate Senior Member

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    The proper “C lip”’and S/S utility wire to back up to C -clip cures that ill
    They will never pop off again.

    stick with the cables forget the electronic stuff. IMO .
    Keep it simple..., stupid!
    Lol!
    Just kidding .
    But do keep it simple.
  9. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    These were the ball and socket style ones. Ball got worn from years of vibration and socket part (end of cable) fell off.
  10. cleanslate

    cleanslate Senior Member

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    Well then , now your F&$?&@!
    Lol!
    Yikes .
  11. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    A tie wrap in the right place got us from SC all of the way to Massachussetts.......LOLOLOL
  12. cleanslate

    cleanslate Senior Member

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    nice ! Whatever it takes at times .

    I’ve blabbed about my old Matthews here. went two or more seasons with just S/S wire tied to hold the throttle cable onto the old Detroit governor...
    Just saying.
    Oops !
  13. mapism

    mapism Senior Member

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    Cruising at 25 kts, I suppose with rudders centered, then one prop suddenly slows to idle speed (but still spinning), and the boat hooks?!?
    I'd be curious to hear what boat she was, if you don't mind me asking.
  14. maldwin

    maldwin Senior Member

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    I have had at least 7 boats with mechanical controls with no issues, and 2 boats with electronic controls which both had control problems. On my Lyman Morse, the controls were down for two weeks, and on my Nordhavn I had multiple breakdowns until the potentiometer failed, and we replaced the hybrid controls with electronic controls. I wanted fully manual controls, but was told I couldn’t do that due to emissions rules. Every time I take the boat out, I have a little fear in the back of my head about the controls going down.
    I had not realized that Glendinning offered a back up system to their controls. Is that unique to Glendinning? I prefer the look and feel of Kobelt, but the backup system would be determinative.
    Why do so many electronic controls have a cheap shiny Sea Ray look, or a cheap plastic look? These are reasonably expensive pieces of equipment, and other than Kobelt, they are cheap looking.
  15. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    I was running a 35' Carolina Classic express SF with a tower. We were on autopilot in the ocean on about day 8 of a delivery from Pensacola, FL. Yeah, one engine went to idle and boat hooked as if you turned the wheel hard over.......maybe even more.......luckily it was calm and didn't take too much to figure out what happened and fix it with everything hot.
  16. mapism

    mapism Senior Member

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    Nope, that's also included as standard in Kobelt actuators.
    If you look at this webpage, the actuator levers with red and black balls on top are the ones that can directly push/pull the mechanical cables connected to the governor and gearbox.
    In case of any electronic fault, they remain 100% functional.

    BTW, normally those actuators are meant to be installed inside the e/r, wherever suitable for keeping the mechanical cable length as short as possible.
    But I've also seen a boat where they were installed inside a cockpit locker, thus allowing not only the emergency usage from a position more convenient than inside the e/r, but also the usage for maneuvering.
  17. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    Backup controls are not unique to Glenndenning. Sturdy controls which were/are OEM for most CAT and a lot of MTU installations always had a backup system. I like the sturdy controls and no they don't have a plasticy look and are all metal.
  18. Pascal

    Pascal Senior Member

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    I used to run a 70 footer with Morse electronic controls. There was a back up cable control on the aft deck but to enable it you had to into the ER and flip a lever on the servos. Trouble is that they were mounted outboard of the engines and impossible to reach when engines were hot. Brilliant install.

    over the years I had one series of intermittent failures on the port engine, first one happening when docking up at fairhaven shipyard then while transiting woods hole is heavy fog. On both cases had to finish on the stbd engine.

    while the Morse had a diagnostic LED, it translated in unknown failure... I eventually traced to problem to the gear control cable between the servo and the gear, it had been moved by a mechanic during service and had too much friction triggering a failure

    had it been a mechanical cable All the way, I would have felt the added resistance right away.
  19. bayoubud

    bayoubud Senior Member

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    I had a connector fall off a gear in forward while docking. The hynautic control felt the same when not connected, delayed figuring out the issue. I like electronic controls, but subject to fail at any time without a warning. Have read some scary post about electronic controls failing. Cables are the more dependable and normally warn you if there is a problem. Every boat we owned with cable controls had cables dragging at some point.
  20. NYCAP123

    NYCAP123 Senior Member

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    Mechanical and electronic controls can both fail. The difference is that you can usually fix or get around mechanical controls with little more than your Leatherman. For electronic you're ordering parts.