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Educated, skilled, safe?

Discussion in 'General Yachting Discussion' started by Thomas Bliss, Jan 28, 2008.

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  1. Thomas Bliss, Jan 28, 2008
    #1
    Thomas Bliss

    Thomas Bliss New Member

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    I was out with three members of my Flotilla on a training and venue patrol today, and I was shocked to see how few boats we met on the water.

    I counted three sail, and three power vessel's, and only one working Tug.
    Then one derelict vessel and a sunken tug

    That got me thinking. There are thousands, and thousands of vessels tied up in the Puget Sound and I see six on the water. What's the deal?

    Today we had partially clear skys, 40 high, and calm seas. And I counted six boats.

    Count me perplexed :confused:,

    Is this a problem with the nouveau boat owners just being so under educated that they are afraid to launch? Weather? Boat show? Fuel Prices?

    I FIND IT VERY WEIRD.

    What's your take?
  2. K1W1, Jan 28, 2008
    #2
    K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

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    I take it from your location that the 40 High you write about is 5.5 Degs Celcius or 1.5 degs C from where the Ice warning comes on in my car.

    This is enough to tell me why there were few hardy souls out there.

    Recreational Boating is supposed to be fun, to me and I assume 000's of others it's about sunny skies, warm airs and calm seas.

    That my 2 cents worth on why there was not a bay full of boats out there with you.

    I will be interested to read other members thoughts on this one.
  3. KCook, Jan 28, 2008
    #3
    KCook

    KCook Senior Member

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    Agree with K1W1 on those temps! Also never underestimate how much folks' lives are driven by schedule and convention. Here in the freaking desert it's plenty warm enough for boating right through the dead of winter. And yet most boaters here put their boats away for the winter, just as if they still lived back east. Simply put, other activities take priority in the winter. Regardless of how fine the weather happens to be.

    By the way, I kinda understand "training", but what do you accomplish on a "venue patrol"?

    Kelly
  4. Thomas Bliss, Jan 28, 2008
    #4
    Thomas Bliss

    Thomas Bliss New Member

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    Venue is where we make ourselves seen in the waterways. Lots of little places for mischief to take place in the old north end of the Port of Tacoma.

    We have a check list of derelict boats to visit, fuel depots, ATON and PATON checks. And training, we did lots of Man Overboard Drills yesterday. I highly recommend everyone practice that little maneuver, its not as easy as it might seem.
  5. K1W1, Jan 28, 2008
    #5
    K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

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    Hi,

    Well Thomas it looks like you were busy especially with all these things that us mere mortals do not understand.

    Could you please tell me what ATON and PATON checks are?
  6. Thomas Bliss, Jan 28, 2008
    #6
    Thomas Bliss

    Thomas Bliss New Member

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    Aton Paton


    Oh yes we are the gods of the water... not! I screwed up big time yesterday, but thats another story, and that is why we train.

    ATON: Aids to Navigation

    PATON: Private Aids to Navigation.
    Private Aids to Navigation (PATON) refers to all marine aids to navigation operated in the navigable waters of the United States other than those operated by the Federal Government or those operated in State waters for private aids to navigation. This includes lighted structures and daybeacons, lighted and unlighted buoys, RACONs and fog signals.
  7. AMG, Jan 28, 2008
    #7
    AMG

    AMG YF Moderator

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    Last week I was on the French Riviera and here are two pictures. The first is over the Port Vauban in Antibes which was full of boats with the exception of the IYCA pier where the big guys are playing elsewhere. Many yachts were undergoing paint jobs, some of them completely covered in those plastic cocoons.

    The other picture is from Monaco on Saturday afternoon, where I could count to about 50 boats at sea, some small sailing regattas and some 40-60 foot powerboats enjoying the sunny day. Even here most of the largest yachts were gone for the season.

    You also had the Monte Carlo Rallye going on and lots of snow in the ski resorts so many people were busy with other things. Typical boat owners here lives far away and just use their boats in the summer.

    Attached Files:

  8. AggieH2O, Jan 30, 2008
    #8
    AggieH2O

    AggieH2O New Member

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    I would lean more towards the less educated wanitng to go out in that weather and not the educated. The educated would be drinking coffee at the marina resturant reading the paper and laughing at the poor souls trying to tie a sail on when they can not feel their face. I love cold weather but it takes a good cause for me to go out with those temps. I do support the man overboard drills.
  9. Thomas Bliss, Jan 30, 2008
    #9
    Thomas Bliss

    Thomas Bliss New Member

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    Man Overboard Drills

    Another comment on the Man Overboard Drills. Few Boaters actually know how to do a MOB drill so I'm going to share a quick tip here. The best thing you can do is practice, practice, practice. Even when you take a group of your friends out for a day. Spend the first hour on the water showing guest how to find PFD's, Flairs, how to use the radio, and pilot too! Show them how to use the throttles and steering. Make it fun.

    Practice Man Overboard Drills (MOB) with a throwable flotation device, and a lightweight gaff, like an EZ-Lock.

    Throw the PFD (throwable seat cushion type) in the water, I use a white one as it makes it harder to see.

    The person that sees the "Man Overboard" Calls it out loud and clear to the Helmsmen/Cox "Man Overboard"!, "Man Overboard"!, "Man Overboard"! giving Port, Starboard or stern. Then the Helm/COX returns the call, "Man Overboard"!, "Man Overboard"!, "Man Overboard"! EVERYONE SHOULD STAY IN THE BOAT!

    The spotter throws a throwable flotation device to the MOB in the water, (not during practice unless you want to) spotter does not take their eyes off that "MOB" pointing to the "MOB" all the while.

    The spotter (still pointing to the MOB) directs the Helm/COX to the victim using simple "O'clock" directions, or degrees. I prefer the O'clock method on pleasure craft. in the AUX we use degrees.

    When the Helm/COX sees the MOB the Helm/COX should say so, loud and clear. However you want to say it, Man Spotted, Victim Spotted, I have the victim in sight. Spotter is still pointing if at all possible, you can still loose the MOB at this point depending on the seas.

    Helm should approach the MOB from the downwind side and I prefer starboard as I can keep an eye on the person in the water. At this point if the MOB is within a few feet from the boat then I throttle down to neutral and let the current carry the MOB to me, keeping the MOB on the starboard side (not as important with center helm). As you get close to the MOB and if the MOB is not wearing a PFD and the MOB has not reached the throwable, throw another PFD to the MOB. When the MOB has a grasp of the PFD and is ready to be pulled in then throw a line to the MOB. If the MOB is wearing a PFD then just throw the line to the MOB as soon as you are close enough to the MOB to reach them with a line. Floatable line is good for this, or a Trem Throwing Line-Sock Type device.

    If the MOB is alert and able to help themselves do not go in the water! 9 times out of 10 that ends up with you now having two rescues on your hands. And if you have to render assistance in the water for Gods sake make sure you have your PFD on! With the victim now secured to a line (engines in neutral) haul them in.

    Get the person below decks. If they are shivering, strip off the wet clothing, bundle, and check them out for signs of injury, and hypothermia. Lack of shivering is not a sign that everything is ok. It depends on how long the person was in the water, and water temp. In extreme cases of hypothermia there may not be any shivering at all. Signs may not present for a few minutes, keep an eye on them. Any signs at all that the victim is in any kind of distress call the Coast Guard and advise them of your situation then head to your closest marina or as directed by the Coast Guard.

    If you are the "Man Overboard". I hope you were wearing a PFD, with a whistle attached. The boat may not be able to see you even if you are only 50 yards away. Smack your arms on the water as to make a splash, that will create a contrast on the seas and make you easier to spot. When you have made contact with the boat chances are that you are in better shape then the persons on the boat, they will all be in distress, panicked, and worried. Be aware of your rescue. If it looks like the props are turning SAY SO! When you are in ear-shot give them your status, "I'm OK" or I'm Hurt", did you put the engines in neutral? Say it a few times, especially if you are OK, let your crew know that.

    Once aboard take stock of your physical condition (if you can). If you were in the waters off Florida in the summer, and you were not injured, and only in the water a few minutes chances are you can continue on, but I always err on the side of safety. If it were here in the Northwest I would go to Hospital and have my victim, or myself checked out.

    I've seen drills that lasted 2 minutes to recovery, and I've seen them last 15 minutes on a boat or yacht. I've seen them last 30 to 60 minutes on Mega Yachts. Practice, Practice, Practice.

    Stay safe, and have fun.
    Thomas
  10. AMG, Jan 30, 2008
    #10
    AMG

    AMG YF Moderator

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    Thanks Thomas,

    A couple of additional tips.

    Since more than twenty years my boats has been equipped with electronic navigation aids. My first move is to make a fix, pushing a MOB button, these days usually a red button on your GPS chartnav.

    Then I check my compass heading and makes a note, before making a pear-shaped turnaround. With these two actions I am better prepared to find the MOB in all weather conditions or in darkness.

    Also remember to lift the person with care, not in just one arm or leg, as you can cause serious damages to nerves. Especially if the person is wearing full clothing which can double the weight.
  11. Thomas Bliss, Jan 30, 2008
    #11
    Thomas Bliss

    Thomas Bliss New Member

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    Yes indeed, great addition! I had though about that as well, glad you added this.
  12. Gareth, Feb 8, 2008
    #12
    Gareth

    Gareth New Member

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    You would be much better off with something that's heavy in the water. I use a five gallon plastic can with one inch holes in it, with a small buoy to keep it afloat.

    Otherwise your trainees will just glide by at 5 knots and scoop the throwable cushion out of the water.
  13. Thomas Bliss, Feb 8, 2008
    #13
    Thomas Bliss

    Thomas Bliss New Member

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    Yup..


    Good idea.

    For our more advanced training we have the twin of "Buster" the dummy from the Mythbusters TV show. The dummy is in full survival gear and is 180lbs soaking wet. Now thats a workout!
  14. K1W1, Feb 9, 2008
    #14
    K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

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    Hi,

    Just like those greasy slippery type , straw and old overall crap soaked dummies used on fire fighting courses
  15. Thomas Bliss, Feb 9, 2008
    #15
    Thomas Bliss

    Thomas Bliss New Member

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    Well... Not quite that bad, we like to stay clean ya know.....
  16. NYCAP123, Mar 18, 2008
    #16
    NYCAP123

    NYCAP123 Senior Member

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    On 2/8/08 I transported a boat from Northport, NY to Sea Brite, NJ. Georgous day. We passed about a dozen clammers, some PD, Fire & CG and a couple dozen seals. It's a wonderful time of year so count our blessings for having it to ourselves.
    Summer won't bring much change though. The key to using a boat is keeping it convenient and PUT YOUR BOATING INTO YOUR SCHEDULE just like the kids soccer games and vacations, etc. because there is always something else to do if there is a cloud in the sky or a sale at the mall.
    BTW, the week before my run was horrible and 2 days later a boat was sunk off-shore in bad weather. The weather gets too crazy this time of year for newbies and help is hard to find. So, let's keep this beautiful time of year for the pros and the experienced.
  17. NYCAP123, Mar 18, 2008
    #17
    NYCAP123

    NYCAP123 Senior Member

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    Excuse my ignorance, but after 50 years boating we old guys tend to forget some things. Since I mainly operate twin screw when my hat goes overboard (so far no people) I spin and follow my propwash back. Does anybody know the technical move of what I believe is called a "Williamson Turn"? It's the move you'd do say with a sail or single in the dark to return to the spot the person went over.
  18. Pascal, Mar 18, 2008
    #18
    Pascal

    Pascal Senior Member

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    teh Williamson turn is what you'd use in low visibility and if you don't have visual contact with the MOB. Note heading, turn 60deg then swing the other way till you're back on reprocical course.

    The single turn (360) is quicker but only works if you can keep visual contact with the MOB.

    as to the original post about few boats out on the water, i often say the same thing, although in this case, the weather has to play a role. Down here though, So Fl, no weather excuses... Some boats almost NEVER leave the slip. Except for the typical sunday afternoon, it's amazing how few owners take advantage of other times when it's great to be out on the water. Even if it's jsut for an evening cruise under the full moon.
  19. NYCAP123, Mar 18, 2008
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    NYCAP123

    NYCAP123 Senior Member

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    Pascal,
    Thanks, now I can explain it. Hopefully never use it. 60,60,60 (equal time) then opposite 60. Thanks. BTW, I think you meant 180 degrees not 360. :)
    I used to have a little tour boat in Lauderdale for about 5 years. So miss those waters, but it always amazed me that nobody would be out even there. That's why I say you have to put it into your schedule like work, vacation, the kid's soccer game, etc. or the boat just sits. And of course the bigger they are the less they cruise. I used to keep a 13 Whaller in my garage and pop it in when the urge hit if even for just a half hour. I kept it convenient so I got out. That's the only way.
  20. T.K., Mar 18, 2008
    #20
    T.K.

    T.K. Senior Member

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    MOB maneouvre is preforming the shape of the letter "p" or "q" with your vessel to return in your same prop wash.
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