Click for Abeking Click for Ocean Alexander Click for Abeking Click for Cross Click for Burger

What do you look for in deciding on brokers, builders, shipyards?

Discussion in 'General Yachting Discussion' started by olderboater, Aug 2, 2014.

You need to be registered and signed in to view this content.
  1. olderboater, Aug 2, 2014
    #1
    olderboater

    olderboater Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2013
    Messages:
    7,132
    Location:
    Fort Lauderdale
    This is brought to my mind by a post just being made by an industry person against rules, after warning and exhibiting at the least a lack of professionalism. Brokers are labelled based on the dishonesty and lack of professionalism of some in the industry. I feel for the good ones as the others perpetuate a negative stereotype. Just as many think of lawyers. Well, there are some excellent ones. We see people suffer huge losses and go through a lot of misery because of choosing builders who were on shaky financial ground, lacked honesty and ethics, and had poor business practices.

    So, I wonder sometimes, do we look adequately at all the factors when choosing who to deal with? Or do we just fall for some sexy boat and our objectivity and judgment flies out the window?

    There are hundreds of brokers out there and behavior like that of today makes it easy for me to say if I needed a broker that I could exclude that one easily from the list. I have reasons for excluding others based on practices I've observed or past behavior. To me it's important.

    And builders or shipyards, I do check out just as I checked businesses I dealt with when I was in business. When looking at a new build I certainly reject builders based on their past practices. Yes, I check to see how many times they've been sued. Too many people have ended up owning boat builders because it was the only way to see their boat finished. There are partially complete boats sitting today on many closed yards. There are a lot of good boats so if I have to go to my second or third choice of a boat to find the right builder, I'm glad to do so.

    I'd be interested in how much depth others here go before deciding who to deal with. If you wanted new and loved a specific boat, would you take a chance on a builder who has shown less than stellar behavior in the past? Do you check background and finances? What about a broker? Do you check their reputation online, check BBB, ask others in the industry? Or do you call them up quickly when you see a boat that attracts you even though you don't trust them?

    Many parts of the industries represented here in YF have negative reputations. I see labels applied. I've seen brokers, captains, and engineers characterized as a group on other forums and I've quickly objected to that, saying I knew some who were good, were honest, and I'd recommend. While the behavior of today that prompted this was minor, the instances of lack of ethics in the industry have caused tremendous hurt to many. The only way that ever changes is by us, as consumers, choosing not to deal with those who don't merit it.

    When you see a brand pop back up, one that has already gone out of business and left people holding nothing once or twice before and some of the same persons involved again, will you do business with them?
  2. NEO56, Aug 2, 2014
    #2
    NEO56

    NEO56 Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2014
    Messages:
    656
    Location:
    Miami
    I have to agree with olderboater here, Brokers for the most part will tell you what you want to hear, and not give you full disclosure/transparency when you call about a boat. At some level, I guess I can't fault them...after all they are representing the Seller/Owner, and as such know what side their bread is buttered on (so to speak).

    As far as shipyards are concerned, I have to agree with you, doing your homework is paramount. I've been waffling on buying an existing boat or a new build. I'm still leaning towards the new build. But I will do my homework with the help of my team (getting larger everyday). I'm guessing that olderboater has been around the block more times than he cares to admit.

    Getting back to Brokers for a moment, I find that most of them have a "turn 'em or "burn 'em" attitude. They was to send you a listing or two...and if you don't wire a deposit within a few days...you go in the trash. They are not willing to spend time forming a relationship, and gaining your trust. Personally I don't do business with people who are not nice, or have ulterior motives.

    Anyway, good thread with lots of insight into this world we call "Yachting".
  3. Demani, Aug 2, 2014
    #3
    Demani

    Demani New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2014
    Messages:
    11
    Location:
    Tampa, Florida
    With all the information we have at our finger tips today their is no reason to be uninformed. Brokers I go by word of mouth from people that have dealt with them in the past. I also try to weed out the people who think it is the brokers fault they did not do their homework nor ask questions. Yes, some brokers are shady and give the rest bad names. I think most fall into the realm of they work for the seller and as a buyer you need to know that. This does not make them dishonest or anything else!

    Best advise I can give you is ask questions, do your research, and formulate a checklist.
  4. olderboater, Aug 2, 2014
    #4
    olderboater

    olderboater Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2013
    Messages:
    7,132
    Location:
    Fort Lauderdale
    Interview them just as you would a potential employee. Most people go through an interview procedure, check references, do background checks on employees they pay small annual salaries. Yet in making a decision for millions, they are hesitant to do the same on brokers and builders.
  5. Caltexflanc, Aug 2, 2014
    #5
    Caltexflanc

    Caltexflanc Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2011
    Messages:
    244
    Location:
    North Carolina
    There's a reason boats are referred to as "she".
  6. Fishtigua, Aug 3, 2014
    #6
    Fishtigua

    Fishtigua Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2007
    Messages:
    2,937
    Location:
    Guernsey/Antigua
    People.

    People build boats and it's all down to the guys and gals doing the job in the correct way. If you find the right manager/engineer/skipper to oversee the build, you've won.

    Honestly, every boat has a personality stamped on it in production. Find yourself a good chief and the injuns will be brave and true. Nothing is worse than a Friday Afternoon job done.

    Agents, by their very job, can only moan after the work is done, not planning beforehand or overseeing as it happens.
  7. Capt J, Aug 3, 2014
    #7
    Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2005
    Messages:
    14,435
    Location:
    Fort Lauderdale
    I'll give a case in point, since the builder has passed away and is no longer in business. Buddy Davis. Buddy Davis was a very good boat builder but a very bad businessman. He turned out some really nice SF and a lot of really bad ones. I happened to run one of the best ones he built which was a 38' FB that was being built for Manuel Noriega. Depending on the boatyards financial situation, was how well or not well each boat was built. If the yard was near foreclosure they would throw the boat they were building together with any old scraps of hose in the yard or anything else and cut corners in order to get payment, then hope to straighten it out under warranty which may or may not happen. If the yard was under good financial times, the employees were being paid and happy, they could churn out a pretty nice boat. But you never know what you got.