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New fridge for 1987 3207

Discussion in 'Carver Yacht' started by iceman3500, Mar 20, 2014.

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  1. iceman3500

    iceman3500 New Member

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    We want to put a new fridge in our boat. The Norcold DE 828 that's in there now shows specs with a cut out of 51 7/8". Any of the replacement models we're looking at (Norcold DE 0061, Vitfrigo 2600, Nova Kool RFU 9000 or 8220) all show a cut out of 52 7/8". Does anyone know if there is an inch of wiggle room on the 3207? I pulled out the old one last summer to try and clean behind it and check things out and, if I remember correctly, there isn't much room. I can't get to the boat right now because it's under 3' of snow. If I am going to be able to replace it, I'm going to need to order something fairly soon to get it to Northern Ontario in time for spring break up. Thanks for the help.
  2. mjkkemper

    mjkkemper Member

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    Iceman if you decide to replace your unit I would be interested in the part b chatter protector. Small orange part underneath the frig. I have been looking for a year now on the discontinued part. If you don't mind I will PM you
  3. iceman3500

    iceman3500 New Member

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    Ok, so not too sure we can replace the Norcold with a new 12v/120 v model. I found a 50" tall 120v fridge that looks like it would fit the hole. If we go this route, we'll need to get an inverter. Not too sure how this will work. We currently use 2 6v golf cart batteries for our house system. Had no problems at all last summer. What do I need to do to add an inverter? Are the 2 house batteries enough? When the boat is on shore power, does the fridge still draw power through the inverter and the on board battery charger just keeps topping up the batteries? Any other suggestions would be very helpful. Thanks again.
  4. g36

    g36 Member

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    hi iceman i have used inverters on all of the boats i have had now. i like them very much although they wont do everything but i sure give mine a work out. sat tv microwave and extra fridge along with some other stuff. i am not an expert but i can over some suggestions on what has worked for me. presently on my 405 i have a dying 12v original fridge. i have been also running an 120v dorm fridge with its own seperate freezer compartment as a backup and to have solid ice cream in the summer. the 12v unit has a small freon leak that i have to add some gas to every couple of months. havent gotton frustrated enough yet to replace it. also this unit had leaked before i bought my boat last year since the saddle valve had already been installed.
    anyway i have 4 golf cart batteries normally and with the addtional fridge i added a group 27 i had laying around so i put in the house bank. gives my total amp hrs of 550 and by using the 50% rule i have 275 ah useable. i have been looking at the summitt ff874 which i guess you may have found(if not what are you looking at?) the summit will fit with slight modification to the opening i have, also it draws the same as my 1999 dorm fridge i am using now. in case you didnt know already 1 amp ac in use equals apx 10 amps dc. the summit use apx 1.2 apms ac. this correlates to apx 12 amps dc from your battery bank on the inverter. as i have measured with my clamp on dc ampmeter on my dorm fridge to verify its draw when installed it. with the cost of the fridge being $500 instead of $1500 or more i will go this route when my 12v gives up. i will also be able to loose the extra grp 27 battery since i wont need it. lots of people will have a different thought on using this set up or going back original 12v/120. but thats not the point of this post. my wife and friends enjoy me having a stash of ice cream and even with the norcold i have the freezer never gets below apx 15-17 so the ice cream was always soft . i wondered if any of the newer 12v manufactures fridge/freezers get closer to zero?.
    as far as the set up i would purchase something like a 2000w inverter pure sine wave is better but modified will work which is presently what i have been using the last 5 years. although more than needed for this you may find other things to run from it once it is installed. the wiring will need to be sized for the inverter and make sure not to put in the engine room if you are using a gas boat unless it is specifically for that application. should not be hard to find a location close but not in there. many come with a remote panel to turn it off and on. some also come with auto transfer switch so if ac power is available it turns off automatically, not neccesary but a neat feature. i would not run the fridge though the inverter all the time while on ac dock power, just install a switch to change over from inverter to ac power. you wnat the battery charger to charge the batteries and it doesnt need and extra load on it for this purpose. i dont know how long you anchor out or in between running generator etc. you will know that .how much of your house bank are you using now? i do know 2 more golf cart batteries will double your current house bank and wont be much more cost. i can help furthur if you want to look into this but i probably wrote enough now sorry! plenty of internet places to get good deals on the inverter and wiring you will still be ahead money wise with this installation over a purchase of a new 12v/120 but it depends on how involved you want to be with this. i enjoy projects on my boat and have done this a few times so its nothing new for me. we anchor lot every weekend in the summer and sometimes a 4 day holiday and i will useally run the genset in the evenings to cool the boat down with ac and recharge my batteries. i also have a battery monitor installed so i know exactly how many amps i have consumed from my house bank . let me know if i can help best wishes
  5. Monepit

    Monepit Member

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    I believe an inverter is the best thing you can install on a boat. Understand, to do it right it will cost you $2000 to $3000. You will need 4 golf cart batteries minimum. 6 would be much better. When you are on shore power or gen the inverter will be charging your batteries and the power will be flowing through the transfer switch in the inverter and powering the circuits it's feeding. The benefit of the inverter is that on top of the fridge you will be able to watch tv, make coffee and run a fan without running the gen. Done right it will be totally automatic. Except checking water in the batteries monthly. A 2000 watt is plenty. It will not run AC, actually it will but it would drain your batteries in a couple hours.
  6. iceman3500

    iceman3500 New Member

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    G36 and Monepit: thanks for the replies. Very helpful. That is the same fridge we are looking at.
    So our boat is a 1987 and probably has that same vintage onboard charger. I think it is a Pro Mariner, 35 amp. Would I be better to switch this out and get a 2000w inverter/charger or just a stand alone inverter? Can the inverter be mounted under the deck in the engine compartment or does it need to be in a vented area? Could probably fit it under the galley stairs depending on the size.
    If you use a stand alone inverter, would you just plug the fridge into it and have an extension cord loose for any other requirements? If you go the inverter/charger route, is that hard wired into your panel so that any plug in is live after that, assuming the inverter is on?
    Either way, I'd need an electrician to rig things up. We need to have the electrical checked anyways. You could feel current in the water around the boat when the shore power or generator were on. Freaked the kids out, never mind the wife. Any thoughts? Loose ground?
    I'm still learning. Thanks again.
  7. g36

    g36 Member

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    do not put the inverter in the engine room anywhere. if under the stairs is outside of it and easily accessible place then having it there with a extension cord might work for you. i prefer (my opinion )a seperate charger and inverter rather than a combo inverter/charger alot of these will also have a built in transfer switch. if your electrician is a friend you might speak with him about your goals but i would be very careful if you are just hiring someone without doing alot of research on inverters to learn what to expect from them and how there hooked up to the house bank etc. to keep it simple and low cost just add the extra batteries and use the extension cord and stay out of the electrical panel, later if you like what you have then it can be hard wired to power certain circuits etc. you might look into another charger if you only have a 35 amp charger which is fine i you are charging from shore power (over a long time)but trying to recharge batteries while running the generator (short time) would take for ever with this low amp unit. for longest life its better to only use apx 1/2 of the batteries capacity and avoid deep discharges.
    if your feeling any current in the water while swimming yes it needs to be seen about immediately. if your not handy with a volt meter it would be probably be best to have someone find the problem for you.
  8. iceman3500

    iceman3500 New Member

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    Ok, so we are still looking into an inverter set up on our 1987 3207. The only thing I want to use it for would be to run a new 120v fridge. I talked to our local marina and they are looking at $7,000 + taxes to install one. For that, we would get a inverter/charger, remote control, two more 6v batteries and wired into the existing panel. They said the last install they did was around 42 hours at almost $100 per hour. They can't give us an exact estimate on our boat as they have not been on it. Obviously way out of my league as that would be about half of what we paid for the boat, before I even got a fridge.
    As I see it now, our starter batteries, one 12v for each engine and one 12v for the generator, and the two 6v house batteries all get charged when we plug in. I think they are all charged off the motor's alternators when we are running.
    If this is the case, can't we just add two more 6v batteries and plug the new fridge into a simple 1000w pure sine wave inverter. Or could we just wire a new plug from the new inverter beside the factory 120v plug that the fridge uses now and switch back and forth between the shore power/generator plug and the inverter plug. It wouldn't really be a physical problem as the plug is easy to get at.
    Sorry if I'm sounding a little slow here but electricity and I can't figure each other out. There has to be a way that we can get something that works for less than +$8,000.
    Any feedback is appreciated.
  9. Monepit

    Monepit Member

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    Omg. That's ridiculous. I've installed about 30 of them. Never had one take more than 8 hours. Some around 6. The 3207 should be around 6 or 7. Especially with adding 2 more batteries. The 8 hour job was a 12 battery setup. A simple inverter and a plug would work fine but charging would take longer on the house charger. They are usually 30 or 40 amps. An inverter with charger is usually 110 amps.
  10. g36

    g36 Member

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    OMG did i say OMG unbelievable

    as stated before just get a simple inverter and do it yourself. if you dont feel up to it you must have some friends around the dock that can install 2 batteries, a fuse and run a couple battery cables. stay out of the electrical panel and mount the inverter in a convient location and plug in the fridge when your away from the dock. how much time do you spend anchored out? that would help with how much house battery you need and how big of a battery charger, but 4 6volts is what i have and i spend lots of time out every weekend . invertors are very nice to have.also remember the batteries will be also be charging while your running your engines and powering you fridge
    theres tons of companies that make good units that dont cost an arm and a leg i have used these inverters for both my boat and rv there is modified and pure sine wave versions. purchased my latest 7 years ago. shop around you'll find plenty others. i run a 120v fridge, sat tvs and more. as i said earlier do not mount this in the engine room. keep this simple and you will have no issues. these are larger than you need for just fridge right now but you may decide you want to run a few more things later and you want turn around and have to buy a larger inverter but that ups to you

    Aims 2500 Watt Power Inverter

    heres one that has a built in charger and transfer switch. which will charge your house bank and also will turn on when the shore power is unplugged so you dont even have to remember to switch the fridge over yourself
    Aims 2000 Watt Pure Sine Low Frequency Inverter Charger

    still cant believe that price they gave you
  11. iceman3500

    iceman3500 New Member

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  12. g36

    g36 Member

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    if you scroll down furthur on the page you see the back side
    battery pos to red black is negative
    http://g-ecx.images-amazon.com/images/G/01/electronics/detail-page2/B000MD5XIE-APS700HF-LG.jpg
    this is only a 700w inverter. which is 5.8 amps ac output.
    700w/120=5.8 it will probably work but it sure is small and really wasting your time with only a 20 amp charger built in. you'll never charge a house bank with that you might as well wait to get back to the dock and your main engines will charge way better than this.
    what is the rating of the refrigerator you are looking at? there is a plate stating watts or amps. plus the compressor start ias to be considered, i would at least consider a 1500w inverter. i know you stated only the fridge but why limit yourself so much?
    please at least look at the inverters at the link i sent you and there are other sizes there also. still can find them on amazon etc. that was just onewebsite i found.
  13. iceman3500

    iceman3500 New Member

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    The part I'm trying to get my head around is how the charger part of the inverter would get the 120v supplied to it. Can i just plug it into an existing outlet when we are on shore power?
    Would I be better to just get a stand alone inverter and let the alternators and shore power take care of the charging?
    We are usually just weekend warriors on the boat. A typical week would be on shore power all week, head out Friday night or Saturday morning, cruise for 4-6 hours to find a nice bay and then do the same thing home on Sunday. Not vey often we would be gone longer than that. Retirement is still a few years away.
  14. g36

    g36 Member

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    yes the inverter/charger will recharge the batteries with an ac source when plugged in on shore power. it will have a cord to plug in or possibly be a hardwired version. i like having charger and inverter seperately but thats me. that way i can upsize my charger to more quickly recover my used amps from the house battery bank while i am running my genset. i have 90amp charger it does a very good job of getting amps back into the house bank.thats why i said what i did about the one you listed with only a 20 amp charger. fine at the dock but mostly useless while out on anchor trying to charge a house bank.

    again need to know what the amp draw on the back of the 120v fridge says
    dc amps will be apx a factor of 10 of the ac. so if the plate is saying 2.0 amps ac you are using about 20amps dc while it is running.

    i would also go as far as looking into led bulbs for your lighting needs. (not changing the fixture just changing the bulbs in them) a very easy switch that will save lots of power from your housebank.
    to keep your batteries healthy and lasting you also dont need to discharge them more than 50%
  15. iceman3500

    iceman3500 New Member

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    The fridge only draws 1.2 amps. The longest that the batteries would not be on some sort of charging system, whether the alternators or shore power would be about 12-15 hours. I think our 6v house batteries are 220 amp/hours and I was going to get two more of the same.
    We have already changed over to LED in the salon and will upgrade the remainder right away. We have a 10 year old so we usually watch a movie at bed time. We just plug the blu ray and tv into a booster pack and that will last us all weekend. If I can get the fridge thing figured out then I will have a happy wife. Then I will be able to have a couple rums and a happy life. Thanks.
  16. g36

    g36 Member

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    then fridge will draw around 12 amps when running getting additional batteries with useable house bank of 220 amps sounds like your ready to get the inverter and install it. piece of cake!
    now since we saved some of the $7000 you can send me a check for $2000 consultation fee, what a bargain, money left to get the inverter, batteries and misc items and have money left over for some more rum lol
  17. iceman3500

    iceman3500 New Member

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    If you ever make it to Lake of the Woods, you're on. If I ever make it to Tennessee, the rum's on me. Thanks again.
  18. iceman3500

    iceman3500 New Member

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    We should have everything we need to install 2 new batteries, an inverter and a new fridge by this weekend. We got a Xantrex ProWatt 200 inverter with remote, an inline fuse holder with 200 amp fuses and Summit FF874 fridge.
    The plan is to mount the 4 6V batteries on a board screwed to the stringers between the motors, mount the inverter outside the engine room on the bulkhead under the galley stairs and just run a line to a new recptacle beside the factory one and then just plug the fridge into the appropriate one depending on shore power or battery power. Does anyone see any problems with this set up?
    I also got a coil of 2 AWG multi-strand welding wire from a buddy to use to make up the cables. The jumpers will obviously be short and the run from the batteries to the inverter should be less than 4'. Is this wire heavy guage enough?
    What is the best place to ground the inverter to?
    Thanks for the help.
  19. Old Phart

    Old Phart Senior Member

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    I dunno
    Just curious, any planned protection

    for the stringers from water intrusion = rot?
  20. iceman3500

    iceman3500 New Member

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    I think I'll just screw some treated 2X4's to the plywood sheet and friction fit that between the stringers so I don't have to drill into them. The weight of the 4 batteries on top should keep it in place. Thanks for the advice.
    Any issues on the cable size? Is it too small?