Click for Northern Lights Click for Ocean Alexander Click for Cross Click for Perko Click for Westport

Standing watch, insurance rates, etc

Discussion in 'General Yachting Discussion' started by RMH, Aug 8, 2012.

You need to be registered and signed in to view this content.
  1. RMH, Aug 8, 2012
    #1
    RMH

    RMH New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2012
    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    California
    Some comments here, notably those made in the Shipwrecked thread, kinda got my dander up.

    There was a comment deriding inattentive/unqualified skippers as why one's insurance premiums are so high. Well, I think that may be only a part of it. Starting from the premise that the 'house always wins', the insurance companies will dictate policy to reflect increase/decrease risk supported by acturial evidence. To wit; being on the waters in and by itself carries an elevated risk. The complexity of systems on a yacht should also not be dismissed; that complexity begats mechanical error and yes, human error.

    While error is often a result of lack of knowledge or experience, it is not solely confined to that. After all, the best minds in the business made a very simple error when they forgot to convert metric to standard. (JPL and Mars Orbiter) Or, witess the recent grounding of the Costa whatever cruise ship. That capt was foolhardy no doubt yet he carried all the knowledge and experience to be qualified for the position.

    Summary: it is the risk inherent of the activity which predomintely affects policy rates.

    Standing watch: Who here has NOT fallen alseep or become inattentive or significantly distracted while on watch? Whether a coastal steaming or long offshore passage, I confess to having done the above.

    For that matter, who here has NOT tied the intended knot or hitch on the first attempt? I mean, have you EVER capsized a bowline or some such thing even after you have earned your advanced qualifications? Or have you taken a wrong turn on a cleat? Bloody hell, I've done it and even if no one was to witness I felt darned sheepish.
  2. RMH, Aug 8, 2012
    #2
    RMH

    RMH New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2012
    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    California
    Additionally, to take the position that unqualified skippers are to blame for higher insurance rates is to dismiss the notion that there exists a level of qualification to offset the factor presented by the unqualified.

    That is, such a belief assumes that the increase in rates due to 'others' (party of the 2nd part) cannot be overtaken by an increase in certs, experience, knowledge (party of the 1st part).

    Therefore, it is not only improbable but impossible that any increase in knowledge, skill, accredited certification will be sufficient to render a reduction in policy premiums which are more than the increased caused by the unqualified.
  3. K1W1, Aug 8, 2012
    #3
    K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2005
    Messages:
    7,393
    Location:
    My Office
    This is something being looked into, how did he get his master licence and then command when most of his time was working in an office ashore?

    I for one have done my best in nearly 30 years at sea to maintain my best senses throughout my "watch" period. I have been told I have been unnecessarily brutal when finding wheelhouse people sleeping on watch.

    When you accept the responsibilities of a deck watch you are undertaking to make sure you do not endanger the folks who are asleep down below. My watch routine underway as an engineer on a fully manned ship requires regular rounds and one of my checks was always to approach the wheelhouse from the outside and look inside with my Torch (Flashlight) more than one deck crew member ( I refrain to call them officers) has felt the lens rim of the torch against their foreheads.



    This is a regularly used knot in a piece of rope or line we are talking about here, I and I am sure others here would be interested to know how you capsize one.

    Would you care to enlighten us?

    BTW: If you ever go over the side under way and are thrown a line how would you fasten it about yourself?

    Are you trying to say that Joe Bloggs who buys a boat and drives it himself should be subject to the same risk assessment as a person who has a lifetime of seafaring?

    On vessels that are over 500 ton there are many rules and regs which include a minimum of certification and experience and thankfully weekend warriors cant drive them unsupervised for the most part.

    Talk to your insurance broker, if you have a lot of experience your premiums might well reflect this , if you have none, likewise
  4. RMH, Aug 8, 2012
    #4
    RMH

    RMH New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2012
    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    California
  5. CaptPKilbride, Aug 10, 2012
    #5
    CaptPKilbride

    CaptPKilbride Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2004
    Messages:
    587
    Location:
    On the water
    While I am not sure I understand why this thread is even here, I will say that I have NEVER fallen asleep while on watch. And, have gotten as "brutal" as KIWI has when finding someone doing so. And make no apologies for it.

    Someone sleeping on watch can kill me. Why shouldn't I be pissed.
  6. travler, Aug 10, 2012
    #6
    travler

    travler Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2008
    Messages:
    276
    Location:
    roche harbor wa
    I M H O and 40 years of being on around and owning boats there is no excuse i to am not one to be very sencetive to some one who is not doing there job on watch there is no second chance peoples lives are at stake , there is no room for complacency

    travler
  7. chuckb, Aug 10, 2012
    #7
    chuckb

    chuckb Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2011
    Messages:
    199
    Location:
    Maine