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Diesel Engine Comparison Question

Discussion in 'Engines' started by W. Arthur, Oct 24, 2011.

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  1. W. Arthur

    W. Arthur New Member

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    I’m looking at two similar boats. Following are the engine choices. Can you tell me which you recommend and a couple reasons why? Thank you for any assistance you may provide! - W. ;)

    1976 – Model: 3208 Caterpillar / 1000 hours

    1999 – Series 400 Turbo John Deer / 750 hours
  2. Bamboo

    Bamboo Senior Member

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    The 3208 comes in at least four variations I believe which are both non turbo and turbo. The non turbo is 210 horse IIRC, and the turbo charged versions start at 320 and go to around 435. I drove a sportfish with the 320 versions and thought they were great. The sister boat had the next higher version and I and the other captains preferred the 320 hp version.

    If you google "cat 3208" you will find plenty of reading.
  3. W. Arthur

    W. Arthur New Member

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    Thanks, Bamboo! - W.
  4. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    They're both good engines and will go a very long time if properly cared for. The 3208's weak point is the cooling system is not overbuilt. Meaning, the heat exchangers and other coolers need to be cleaned at the regular interval, there's not a whole lot of margin there. The 3208's can be smoky at startup (not DD bad though, but always visible) and stay that way until they reach temperature, but they only read temperature under a load and will never reach operating temperature just idling at the dock.

    John Deere's are built stout and designed to go many hours, however I'm not too familar with their marine propulsion engines to comment on anything else.
  5. W. Arthur

    W. Arthur New Member

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    Thanks, Capt J. I'm taking record of all suggestion details! - W.
  6. Karl2

    Karl2 New Member

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    I have limited but some experience with the 3208 - A 1976 vintage will, I assume, be rated fairly conservative. Nothing wrong with this motor.
    I have 0 experience with the JD but I'm assuming its a good motor too.

    In your shoes and as far as the engines I would focus on the local support available to you: Who will come to the rescue when you have a problem (No matter how good the motor, sooner or later you will) ? Does your local dealer/distributor have parts for your engine ? Talk to fellow boaters that owns a similar CAT or JD. Go visit the dealer they recommend. Talk to the dealers Service and Parts guy and see how warm and fuzzy you feel.

    All major engine suppliers (CAT, Cummins, JD, MAN, MTU, Volvo, etc...) have good products. IMO it comes down to the support they provide after you write the big check.

    Good Luck
    Karl
  7. W. Arthur

    W. Arthur New Member

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    Thanks, Karl! Good advice. The boats are 700 miles separated. One nearby, one I'd bring home on her bottom. It's nice to have forum to seek input from those with personal experience! - W.
  8. Capt Ralph

    Capt Ralph Senior Member

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    I'm finding more of the commercial boats have or have re-powered with Deer equipment. Not heard anything bad. I think that means something.
    I've studied the installation (like a kid in the x-mas window) of a few rigs and I like what I see.
    When I win the Lotto, a Deer setup would be my first choice for my re-power.

    Luckily, there IS ONE shop in Jacksonville FL that is trusted to work on them.

    If you have a Deer shop that you like in your area, and can find Deer support along your common routes, I do recommend the Deer.

    Looking back, Your stated a 1976 model 3208 with 1K hours?
    1000 since overhaul or total? Condition of HEs?
    38 year old motors hold a lot of secrets.
  9. W. Arthur

    W. Arthur New Member

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    Hi rcrapps... TY for input on Deers. I'm leaning that way. Found that boat is closer to 1,300 miles away, rather than the orig 700 I thought. Fun trip may be ahead! Have hot found yet if the Cat 3208 are orig 1000 hrs or since a major. Good part is the one with 3208's is only a few hours away. I’ll be contacting broker today and hope to soon get a look-see... you’re so correct though – 38 yr engines can hold deep secrets! – W.
  10. RVN-BR

    RVN-BR Senior Member

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    sorry for jacking this, but I didnt know if it was appropriate to start a new thread since this one is kinda related.... Found it searching anyhow...

    Can someone give a general (I assume this exists officially from the mfgr) guideline of engine services/major/minor/rebuilt etc, as well as specifics (parts/rough cost/man hrs, etc) of the "lifecycle" of a cat engine, specifically considering a boat with a "3406E Dita 600hp"...

    Engine should be around 2000 or so build, and currently have something around 6500hrs... I will eventually have access to what has been done (at least supposedly, in terms of services, etc) but would like to have an idea what to expect, and wht to look for. How long should/could they last? (I have read in the other man thread that @5000hrs its about time for a full rebuild)... what would be the case with these? It is a displacement vessel, if that makes any difference.

    Also of interest and comparison would be the same sort of info about a Perkins Sabre 6TG engine which powers a generator. This I understand has even more hours (something around 10k), even though everything is said to have been serviced along the way from 2000 to now, I still wonder what is to be expected and what is to be looked out for...

    Also, can someone perhaps give a ballpark for rebuild or replacement cost (minus labour obv) for these 2 items?

    Thanks so much!
  11. Capt Fred

    Capt Fred Senior Member

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    Back to the original thread, I like CAT but you need to consider that the 1976 engines have been sitting for long periods of time to only accumulate 1000 hrs and that allows the cylinders to rust/corrode internally. There maybe actually more wear on these engines than indicated by the hours.
  12. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    Caterpillar should have a maintanence guide on their website and will list everything including the rebuild schedule. I think the 600hp 3406's are rated to go 10,000 hours, but I cannot remember for certain. I do know that they are a very good engine and reliable.
  13. RVN-BR

    RVN-BR Senior Member

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    HiCaptJ thanks... Do you happen to have a link or page name? I searched around the cat site and havent found much... searched for the particular engine (I assume its discontrinued in favor of the newer series?) and also in the service/parts area and couldnt find anything really useful?

    It may be my research skills are off...

    ps: i did find the legacy page of the engine, but not much info... http://marine.cat.com/cat-3406E
  14. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    Used Diesel Engines | Detroit Diesel | Caterpillar search for your engine then click on the print/pdf link for the full brochure
  15. RVN-BR

    RVN-BR Senior Member

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    Got fuel curves and some other data for the smaller hp versions, but not really what i was looking for... thanks anyways...
  16. Loren Schweizer

    Loren Schweizer YF Associate Writer

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    Diesel engineers will be quick to tell you that operating hours don't so much matter as does the amount of fuel that's gone down the holes.
    And, consequently, the engine rating becomes paramount since a 'B' motor burns less fuel and is lightly stressed compared to a 'D' engine.

    Happily, both the Cat and Perkins you mention are both inline-sixes and are inherently better balanced engines compared to vee-configured machinery and enjoy, generally speaking, longer lives.

    I'd suggest calling a local Cat dealer's service manager for more specifics on how much fuse is remaining and pertinent costs. They might even be familiar with that particular engine.
  17. Kapn

    Kapn Member

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    I'll second the amount of fuel burned correlates to the wear expected on the engine. I'm pretty sure the original poster mentioned a Cat 3208, which is a V8, and a John Deere. The cooling systems and the 1000hr service on the 3208 are the things to look out for.