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Project Manager Rates

Discussion in 'General Yachting Discussion' started by JWY, Jan 4, 2018.

  1. JWY

    JWY Senior Member

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    I'm looking for the general range of rates that a project manager should expect. I know, it depends on size, location, extent, and numerous other factors. However, I have 2 separate clients looking to do a mechanical and cosmetic refit on boats 40 - 65 feet, both boats are in Florida and both owners are not. Would appreciate any helpful information in regards to a project manager overseeing work done in a yard, by mechanical subs, etc.

    Judy
  2. Ormond Bert54

    Ormond Bert54 Senior Member

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    I have a marine general contractor in the Daytona are who is excellent. He charges for certain work and doesn't for other work. For instance, he handled removing and installing the engines and charged for that but I paid the overhaul shop directly for their work. Overall it's an excellent relationship and I trust him. His name is Joe Kuehl with Pro-Boat 386-212-7159 Joe is fair and a straight shooter with an excellent reputation.
  3. Bamboo

    Bamboo Senior Member

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    So what are his rates? That is the question at hand. :)
  4. Ormond Bert54

    Ormond Bert54 Senior Member

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    It's interesting that I cannot answer your question regarding his hourly rates because I have never taken note of that and I'm sure that it doesn't matter. The issue is whether you are getting value for your money. Hourly rates are often just a big ripoff in disguise. Somebody can charge $70/hr and lie about the hours or $140/hr and lie about the hours or $90 and be honest about the hours but do bad work. My answer is that you will find that it's difficult to nail down the rate but that it's very easy to get ripped off. When I purchased my Bertram 54 back in 2010, I hired a "project manager" for $200 / day and wasted at least $30k that way. I would give Joe a call and ask him. What Joe has is the very thing that the OP is looking for though and that is integrity.
  5. PacBlue

    PacBlue Senior Member

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    Well stated!
  6. Beau

    Beau Senior Member

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    I agree that once you have established a rapport and know each other estimates and stated rates become less important, but I sure wouldn't give anyone carte blanc first time out
  7. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    It depends. Is the "project manager" doing any of the work? I normally charge around $30 hour to babysit people and $60 an hour for mechanical labor or to babysit vendors and assist them or make managing decisions. My prices are a tad on the cheap side for the amount of experience I have.
  8. bsd222

    bsd222 New Member

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    I hired a project manager to handle a complete exterior paint job on my 65 Viking.I added a fair amount of additional work in the engine room and interior once the job had started.Guy did a great job, was very knowledgable and great at sourcing materials and qualified subs to handle the work.PM me if your interested in the details.
  9. JWY

    JWY Senior Member

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    Thanks for all of the replies and referrals!

    Judy
  10. PacBlue

    PacBlue Senior Member

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    I have a question for those that use Project Managers, do you require a written plan from them that gets signed offed/approved? Something like a Microsoft Project Schedule that shows resources and critical paths or just a clean excel spreadsheet with sufficient information?

    I personally would have that kind of expectation, but do not know if it is prevalent in our industry?
  11. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    Generally in most situations, I am working from a survey. I then mark time frame/quotes etc. based on each survey item. Usually everything is done via email. It just depends a lot on the situation. Many times I'm doing half of the survey items myself +/- along with a helper that works for me. If other companies are working, say the CAT dealer, I'll keep tabs on them while doing my own work without any additional fees, etc.

    The biggest and most important item of a project manager is coordinating the right people to work at the same time and not the wrong ones so that subcontractors don't come and waste their time because they cannot work on the items that they need to get done because someone else is in the way, another project isn't done yet, and so on and so on. My customers ALWAYS save money by having me manage the items because of several reasons, I work very efficiently and my labor rate is less than subcontractors, I do so much business with the various sub contractors and have for 2 decades that I can get them to prioritize my work over others and they give me a better rate, and everything is done very efficiently.

    OTOH, I have had new owners buy a boat I've managed/maintained for years. Then, they have hired me to continue on, then have hired half a dozen other people to do jobs without saying anything.....ie cushion/canvas, electronics, etc. Well then everyone's tripping over each other, including myself, the jobs linger on for weeks and weeks longer than if I had hired the people, the jobs cost more to an absentee owner who isn't there, and the quality of work is less. The stories I could tell..........like the idiot the broker recommended to replace the electronic vaccuflush toilet, where they guy installed positive to negative and negative to positive and went to the boat 4 times over 2 weeks and couldn't figure out what he did wrong, meanwhile I figured it out in less than 10 minutes and learned the guy fried both circuit boards on the toilet in the process on a brand new toilet.
  12. K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

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    Your correct in that co-ordination or the lack of it can be the make or break of any project. Deciding what should be done and doing it is also very important. I once tried to explain to an Owner who was doing his own project management that if a job took two men 5 days and he didn't like it and it took two men 2 days to pull it apart and 5 more days to reinstall it again that was 24 man days for a 10 day job. He was a supposedly intelligent guy who obviously had made a bit of money but he could not get his head around this basic concept. He ended up walking away and owed the shipyard a ton of money. I saw the boat a few years later, someone else had finished it off and it looked really nice.
  13. olderboater

    olderboater Senior Member

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    It's like anything else, shortcuts get costly in time and money. Select those you know you can trust to do the job right. Pricing from a substandard vendor is of no value whatsoever.
  14. bobhorn

    bobhorn Member

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    Guy I worked with for many years had a saying: "If you don't have the time to do it right the first time, where do you get the time to redo it?".

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