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Bertram 50/54

Discussion in 'Bertram Yacht' started by BrandName, Jun 15, 2006.

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  1. Loren Schweizer

    Loren Schweizer YF Associate Writer

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    This seems odd since the 57 was, essentially, a stretched 54, as was the 60.
    And, we all know how unpopular they were :rolleyes:
  2. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    Yes, and it rides nothing like the 54. The center of gravity is too far foward on the 57' and it rides flat and then nose dives into a wave every once in a while sending a wall of water completely covering the strataglass. The 54' had fuel tanks in the center of the engine room and further aft, while the 57' has one large (I think it was 1400 gallons) tank that makes up the foward wall/bulkhead of the engine room. The one I ran had one generator (under the cockpit floor, rear of the engine room) and might have had more weight in the stern if it had the 2nd one (option). If the holding tank was over 50% to full it made the boat pound in 3-5's, because it was located near the bow. The 57' is just too bow heavy, there is no weight in the entire rear of the boat from the salon door rearward except 1 generator. This boat also only had a hardtop, so it didn't have a tower that could've possibly shifted center of gravity.

    I have run a 54' with 12v71TI's that cruised at 30 knots (hardtop boat also, no tower). It rode/ran totally different then the '57.

    The worst sea I had the boat in was 5-7'. Needless to say the boat went back to the factory because ALL of the bulkhead to stringer tabbing was breaking loose. The bulkheads were breaking loose from the stringers. It then went back to the factory where they had the boat over 4 months, and re-glassed all of the tabbing and extended the hull warranty only 1 year. Very poor. The pulpit was also seperating from the hull.

    Another nagging issue was the dinette table was too close to the seat for anyone of any size to slide into, including the owner. The beds including the master were too short, me being 6'3, my ankles hung off of every single bed in every stateroom.
  3. LA BUC

    LA BUC New Member

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    How about the late 80s model 54? Any of you out there have had experience with one? Looking at a repowered late 80s with CAT 3412 and another with 3412TA....I have heard nothing but positives regarding the ride of these older 54s.

    Thanks in advance guys.
  4. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    Yes, I ran a wore out 1984 54'. It had a hardtop and worn out 12v71's that had 4700hrs on them without a rebuild. It would smoke grey smoke up a storm for the first 15 minutes. The engine surveyor was afraid to do a WOT test on them. I ran the boat and at 1900rpm's it did 30 knots. Very impressive, the boat was light on fuel and had no additional owner's equipment. We were in 3-5's and it rode nice and was completely dry.
  5. craigsduc

    craigsduc New Member

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    Location:
    Thousand Oaks
    As we are now in contract on a 90 50 with 860 mans ( new from factory in 03 ) with 500 original hours, I am curious to see real figures. I,m told the boat cruises @ 27 kts at about 60 gallons/hour. Will see! Sounds too good to be true but I am told it is due to these 860s. Has tower and down galley with 2 srs. My plan is to install a new aft galley in the salon with counter and 2 to 3 bar stools facing aft with a L shaped settee forward with a high low table for lounging/sit down eating. Not sure what I will do with the down galley area but most likely will build a lower bunk/lounge with possibly a fold down upper bunk. Would like to install a pair of proper port holes on both sides but not sure if that will kill selling it someday. We also plan on towing a tender on our Bahama trips vs a davit/RIB on the bow. For the cost of the davit, we can buy a used 20 to 22 center console for running around in the islands. We were told that would be the way to go. Opinions?

    Will let you know the real cruise/burn figures when we see them first hand. Flowscans maybe.
  6. Capt J

    Capt J Senior Member

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    I ran a 57' it was wetter then a Submarine and the COG is too far foward with more then 1/2 a tank of fuel. Your fuel figures are off as well and are per motor and light at that with C32's. C 32's burn 140 GPH at 80% load for a pair which usually tends to be around 2050rpms or slightly higher. At 1900 rpm's you'd be at around 125-130GPH and at 1900 you should be doing close to 35 knots. I ran a 57' with a Hardtop and with 1300hp MAN's it cruised at 31 knots at 1950rpms. C32's put out 1625hp or more depending on whether or not they're ACERTS.

    1050 MANS burn 65-70GPH for the pair at 1950rpms, 860's are around 50-55GPH (both) at 1950rpms typically usually closer to 50 gph.

    Towing a 20-22' center console should be no problem but will cut cruising speed about 2 knots. I know someone that towed a 26' whaler behind a 50' Bertram with a tuna tower. Keep in mind you will need an extra person to deal with the tender (unhooking and hooking it) running it into the inlet etc. It would be A LOT more useful in the Bahamas then a 14' Inflatable and davit on the bow of the 50'. You will need the proper tow harness, bow eye and such on the tender you're towing.
  7. craigsduc

    craigsduc New Member

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    Sounds like the figures I was given are accurate on the 860s. Also sounds like the CC recommendation is sound too. Based on the notes, Stuart seems like it might be good choice to look into. The broker on the boat mentioned paying for a hurricane option in a protected marina inland to take it to in the event of a hurricane. My question was is it possible to simply keep it full time in a protected marina or is there such a marina there. My thought is there really isnt such a thing. I certainly have no plan on leaving it in the Bahamas now as an absentee owner. That too seemed to be a careless plan. I obviously need to set up with a reliable captain....or two to move the boat if needed for me. I would like to keep it in a marina where we would feel we are on vacation even in the marina itself so location is important. As with here, some marinas simply are nicer and have more amenities than others. Regarding insurance, if there are those with good suggestions regarding brokers/companies to contact as well as information I should give them which will affect the cost, it would be appreciated. Weve had boats our whole life ( 41 being the last one 5 years ago ) so the 50 Bertram is the biggest to date. I plan on utilizing a captain initially until I familiarize myself with it and especially on our first trip to the Bahamas but do not want to be locked into having a captain on board to operate as I never have.......
  8. NYCAP123

    NYCAP123 Senior Member

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    The biggest problem with a protected marina is that protected means off the coast. That could put you a couple of very slow hours away from the inlet. You can get a captain to check on your boat on a regular basis and move it pre-hurricane. He can also recommend someone to do any other task like washing, mechanics, etc. and can hire on per diem or recommend another captain if not available for lessons and your early trips. No need for a F/T captain on something like that.
  9. craigsduc

    craigsduc New Member

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    Yes indeed, we do not want a FT captain. Just a reliable and honest as well as intelligent guy we can depend on to look out for our interests without unnecessarily running up a bill. Sounds like we will need to move the boat regardless from our regular slip to a protected area in the event........Keeping the boat behind someones home seems like it wouldnt work either as we might stay aboard periodically there which would be a bit strange to do in someones back yard........unless of course they were never there and could use someone to look after their place when we were there.............not a likely scenario! Palm Beach north to Coco Beach would be the borders to stay within but logistics important too for the Bahamas. We really want to go where there are other boat owning/loving families with little ones to enjoy some island time with as well as going to some places where we might want to stay at.......forever...............hmmmmmmmm. Sounds good. Weve heard so much about the bahamas that we simply elected to buy our boat in Florida and leave it there at least through this year. We actually really are considering relocating there for a few years and enjoying a boating lifestyle as it is who we are. Its so limited here in Southern California with colder water and smaller windows of opportunity to visit the islands. Ultimately, we have thought of NZ in about 2 to 3 years. Colder water yes but a potentially happier place to raise our daughter.

    Oh well, better stop at that before I start venting about where I see the US going.

    Thanks for the insight.
  10. K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

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    Hi,

    You might want to start doing your homework on that issue as well before making the leap.
  11. Ormond Bert54

    Ormond Bert54 Senior Member

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    My 1984 Bertram 54 will be going back in the water in just two days. It has the 12V71TI engines.

    Changes include one fresh overhaul with low hours on the other, removal of the full tower and replacement with standard soft top, fresh bottom paint.

    I am hoping for an easy 22-23 knots cruise and 28 knots WOT. I will be really happy if I see 24 knots cruise and 30 knots WOT. I know the fuel burn even at 22 knots will be positively insane so I'll probably spend the majority of the time cruising at 15 knots.

    Attached Files:

  12. CaptOz

    CaptOz Member

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    Miami, Fl
    Well,

    How did your see trial go finally? Boat looks amazing!..

    How much did you pay for a rebuild? What are you new cruising and GPH numbers?

    Best,
    Ozzy
  13. 54' Bertram

    54' Bertram Member

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    New Orleans, Louisiana
    I don't think he got to the 24 cruise/30 WOT. I have the same setup and have a 20/21 cruise burning 60 gal and 29 WOT burning a hole in my wallet
  14. Ormond Bert54

    Ormond Bert54 Senior Member

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    I'll check again soon ... I believe I have 26 knots WOT which is precisely what the boat did before the rebuild but with a full tower at that time.

    I'm really enjoying the boat and very happy to be free from Orange Beach, Alabama. My service experience there was piss poor.
  15. dockeffer

    dockeffer New Member

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    freeport
    I had a 46 ex wild thing, prior to this ex jammer. It had 8-92 735 hp. it would cruise 25 knots at 1950, and keep the transom clean. I now have a 50 bertram, was repowered with c 18 cats. 1000 hp. 1500 20 knots, 1600 22 knots, 1750 25knots,1850 27 knots, 1950 29 knots, it gets .44 to .49 nautical mile per gallon depending on speed and load. Ran straight across from clearwater florida thru baptiste collette and into venice La , 375 naut miles in 15 hours. took 810 gallons to do trip. The cats respond to the throttle like outboards and make absolutely no smoke except for a puff at start up. The fifty is much dryer than the 46. Boat is with Fox yachtsales. Getting ready to put on a aluminum rubrail and paint the cockpit this fall.
  16. coffee break

    coffee break New Member

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    air vents

    Did you consider removing the air vent scoops from the side decks!!!
  17. coffee break

    coffee break New Member

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    what do you mean by putting an alluminum rubrail!! You mean replacing the alluminum with the PVC? How come you are selling the 50?
  18. Ormond Bert54

    Ormond Bert54 Senior Member

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    I'm seeing around 20 knots at 1850 rpm with full fuel. 1450 gives me approx 14 knots. I have not considered moving the air intakes as I have no reason to believe the engines are being starved for air and have not been looking for a place to put many many thousand dollars. My engines are the 12V71TI 800 hp versions. This speed is several knots slower than I would like but the boat feels great at sea, is burning less fuel than I expected.

    The speed is identical to what it was before the overhaul of the port side engine.

    Mike

    Attached Files:

  19. coffee break

    coffee break New Member

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    Mike
    she look absolutely stunning!!
    I have a 46 and I'm dreaming about redoing a 50 or 54. Mine is on the market with a lot of people loving it but no money or credit to buy it!!
    Anyway back to the 54s, I been looking at a ton of them up and down the coast and is been very confusing!!
    I have a friend that was mate on one of them named Dolphin which was just sold at an increadable price, which had me in touch with the captain and they told me that with 800 hp 12v71 (boat has a tower) he was cruising at 1900 rpm doing 25 knots( I know they were not lying).
    I'm also looking at another one that has 900 ph 12v71 that guarantees me 25 knots at 1950 rpms.
    I also saw a bounch of others that they will only do 22 knots at best @ 1950.
    The only reason why I asked about the air scoops was only for estetics reasons!!
  20. Ormond Bert54

    Ormond Bert54 Senior Member

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    Thanks ... I'm loving it. I had her up in Maine during the summer and considered pulling her out of the water for the off-season up there ... decided to bring her to Maryland where I am for 9 months of the year ... so glad I did. I have been able to continue the trouble shooting process while spending lots of time on board and I'll be leaving her in the water throughout the winter months.

    I figure once things settle down with the finances, I will have a propulsion study done and new props. They are the original 3 blades on there now ... 28" ... the shop says they are 28 pitch but the book says they are supposed to be 32 pitch. Either way ... seems I'm a little slow but not the only one. I have talked to others with a B54 ... 800 hp engines getting approx 20-21 knots ... 1800 rpm.

    Also .. the book indicates 1800 rpm = 23 knots = 52gph. ... seems normal that the boat would underperform book ... and it does!

    The market is calling for give-away prices so don't hold your breath with regard to selling the 46.

    And ... yes ... the credit is hard to come by these days ... one of the few astute things I did with regards to purchase was work a deal with the bank who owned the boat.