[yachtttty]

I actually have a friend who did this: How many of us think it is right for a captain to take his parents on a ten day cruise, without the owner's knowledge? Specifically, the vessel is being transported to the Carribean to hopefully pick up some charter business, and the captain allows his parents to come along, sleep in one of the several vip cabins, and even stay on board for several more days once the destination is reached. Sounds like theft to me--am I wrong? The particular owner stated quite clearly upon retaining the captain that no unauthorized persons would be allowed aboard, and such was even included in the employment contract. I would love to hear everyone's thoughts about this situation, and how the owners you know would deal with it.

[YachtForums]

Originally Posted by yachtttty

I actually have a friend who did this:

Soliciting responses based on a hypothetical situation is one thing, but posing as as someone seeking advice for a friend, when in all probability you're compiling information to build a case against this captain, is misleading. Frankly, it borders on fraud and we take a zero-tolerance approach to this kind of clandestine conduct. Moreover, the collective knowledge of our members and this website is NOT a place for entities unrelated to our industry to tap into.

Your duplicate post has been deleted. I'll let this thread remain, but with a head's up to our captains who may choose to respond.

[C4ENG]

I was wondering why any one would feel so strongly against some one trying to spend some time with there family.....
Not like we go home every night and spend our holidays and what not with our loved ones...

[RoyN]

I agree with both replies, but it is still very wrong to do what the supposed captain in post 1 did....

As a yacht owner I would feel extremely annoyed and cheated had the above happened to me. If I expressed my wishes to not have anyone onboard, it doesn't matter how long the captain hasnt seen his folks, if he's on the job, he must follow what is laid down.

I personally would most probably allow the captain to take his parents, or to meet them at the destination and have a few days off with them (even fly them there if the captain is going to be away for a long time), but unauthorized behaviour SHOULD be punished...

I'm sorry, but a yacht isnt a play-job. it requires a LOT of serious dedication and it requires someone that is very strict. Bending of the rules, and right-out disobediance of something laid down by the owners is ridiculous, and it speaks badly of all captains...

It is as if you allow your parents to stay for free at the hotel you work, even though the manager/owner wouldnt aprove... isnt that borderline stealing?

[AMG]

Originally Posted by RoyN

It is as if you allow your parents to stay for free at the hotel you work, even though the manager/owner wouldnt aprove... isnt that borderline stealing?

Yes, you can compare a yacht for charter with a hotel. And you can say that when the hotel was closed, the manager allowed his parents to stay there. Well, not exactly stealing..?

In this case, either the owner like to keep the captain and then tell him to not repeat this behavior. Or the owner want to replace him and can claim he breached the contract. I guess the parents were eating with the crew and caused no big expenses. Otherwise, the owner may withhold the costs incurred.

I know this happens sometimes, (bringing family), but I think the owners use to be aware of and allowing it in those cases.

[CaptPKilbride]

I am sure yachtty, in his first and only post on this forum, may not filled in all the blanks in this situation. Here is my take on things:

The owner should always be informed as to who is onboard his yacht at all times. Period. Amen.

What Yachtty describes as a "cruise" sounds more like a delivery to me. He did say the vessel was being re-positioned to the Caribbean for charter work. It is conceivable that the captain viewed having family members aboard as delivery crew, and they stayed on a few days after arrival. None of this is egregious in my view, though the captain should have informed the owner.

Yachtty, as Carl posted, it seems quite suspect that you registered to post on these forums seemingly just for this purpose. Do you have anything more that you would like to add about the scenario? Any bits that have been left out?

[K1W1]

Hi,

Maybe Yachtty has an axe to grind because he/she was not allowed to take their partner along for the trip.

It is different to a certain extent with each and every owner. I have worked for some who were very happy to have senior crew members family onboard for a delivery and others who would want to know what rate they were paying. It takes all types.

If the Captain chooses to do something strictly against the Owners wishes then it will be his head that roles if he is caught out.

You might also find out that the Captains Contract differs markedly from that of other crew on board in the benefits he receives and the things he is permitted to do and not do.

[YachtForums]

Originally Posted by K1W1

Maybe Yachtty has an axe to grind because he/she was not allowed to take their partner along for the trip.

Nope. Yachttty is an attorney and he sent me an e-mail indicating he was the owner of the boat, so once he again he wasn't honest about the situation.

Just realized I said honest and attorney in the same sentence.

[Seafarer]

When we had a captain, his niece and nephews were allowed aboard with his sister and brother-in-law on a limited basis - usually when delivering north or south for the season or brief cruises of a few hours or so. Provided the boat was not in use for business purposes (sending customers out on fishing trips or cruises as marketing) or was not supposed to be anywhere else, we viewed it as good employee relations. Carl was happy, the boat was maintained and exercised, and Carl always made sure it was kept in proper order.

The key is limited basis, and with our knowledge. Since we didn't charter (and it seems your boat was not currently in the charter business) it wasn't theft in our eyes. Parents on the boat during a delivery? What costs could possibly have been incurred to make a big deal of it?

The only concern I'd have is whether or not this would fall under charter use for insurance purposes. Liability could be the only issue I'd really be concerned with.

Then again, my upbringing was not to be a nasty, litigious person.

[yachtttty]

Let me be clear. For whatever reason, the administrator of this site immediately assumed that since I am an attorney, i was trying to dredge up a lawsuit, which is not what I'm trying to do. I indeed am an attorney, but I am also an owner of several yachts. I posted because I am legitimately trying to get industry standard information. My yacht cost me in excess of eight million dollars. I hired a captain and entrusted him with my boat. He was to move it down to the Carribean for my use and perhaps for charter work. When he was hired, he was instructed by me and my assistant that no unauthorized individuals were to be aboard. I had previously had problems with my other yacht where my captain had his children aboard while I was present and when I wasn't, without asking permission or even informing me. So, I found out that on the trip to the carribean, and for several days there, my captain had his parents aboard. I never knew about this, and was never asked if it was ok. My chef fed these folks daily. Now, this may be industry standard, or it may not be. I am not in the industry. I don't think so, and the reason for this post was to make sure my gut is right.

[CaptPKilbride]

I am not all that sure you are going to find an industry "Standard".

Every program is different, based on the desires and demeanor of the owner.

It sounds as if you were very clear about your expectations with your captain, and those expectations were violated. You have two choices: Find another captain, or have a serious and frank discussion with the current captain, letting him know that you have made your expectations clear, and that another infraction will result in termination of his employment.

If you decide to keep the current captain, you are going to have to "trust, but verify". Which, I guess you must do with any individual you are giving responsibility for a major asset.

If you are going to fire your captain for this transgression, don't say that he violated an industry standard, and all these nice people here on this internet forum agreed with "your gut". Instead, just say that he violated your work rules. Plain and simple.

[Seafarer]

Originally Posted by yachtttty

Let me be clear. For whatever reason, the administrator of this site immediately assumed that since I am an attorney, i was trying to dredge up a lawsuit, which is not what I'm trying to do. I indeed am an attorney, but I am also an owner of several yachts. I posted because I am legitimately trying to get industry standard information. My yacht cost me in excess of eight million dollars. I hired a captain and entrusted him with my boat. He was to move it down to the Carribean for my use and perhaps for charter work. When he was hired, he was instructed by me and my assistant that no unauthorized individuals were to be aboard. I had previously had problems with my other yacht where my captain had his children aboard while I was present and when I wasn't, without asking permission or even informing me. So, I found out that on the trip to the carribean, and for several days there, my captain had his parents aboard. I never knew about this, and was never asked if it was ok. My chef fed these folks daily. Now, this may be industry standard, or it may not be. I am not in the industry. I don't think so, and the reason for this post was to make sure my gut is right.

Why not authorize an occasional goodwill visit, enjoy a better working relationship with your employees, and stop trying to create the most hostile work environment possible? It sounds like this is more a CONTROL issue than a TRUST issue for you.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by yachtttty

Let me be clear. For whatever reason, the administrator of this site immediately assumed that since I am an attorney, i was trying to dredge up a lawsuit, which is not what I'm trying to do.

*Snip*

Stating your case honestly in your first post could have avoided all assumptions.

[yachtbrokerguy]

A really good captain is as hard to find as a really good yacht. A really good captain-owner relationship is even harder to find.
It sounds like the captain failed the owner's trust, and the the owner made the captain feel he could not even ask permission, not for friends, but for the most important people in his life.

[Garry Hartshorn]

There are a lot of if's and's and but's in this story. However speaking as a captain I believe it is the captains duty to operate the vessel with which he is charged in acordance with the owners wishes as closely as possible. Having said that an owner needs to be flexible and understanding if he wishes to keep a good and stable crew that will do what ever it takes to look after the yacht and guests.

One has to remember that an experianced captain and other senior crewmembers have spent years away from friends and family in the persuit of his or her career which can and does put a strain on one's personal life. While I do not condone the actions of the captain mentioned I do understand. I also think if the owner wishes to be a hard ass then in the end he will have a crew who do not really care about the boat or the guests and will only do the minimum to stay employed.