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Old 04-16-2009, 08:59 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Wireless Networks

As well as the forums fulfill my thirst for knowledge and thanks to all, I have yet to encounter any thread on wifi and carbon!!

Does anyone have any history with wireless networks on carbon sailing or motor yachts.? I know of yachts that have had problems (racer-cruisers and racers- sailing yachts) with trying to get signals to B&G Deckman tablets as the signal goes all over the shop.....anyone care to enlighten me??

I work in an industry somewhat related and as every yacht gets more hi tech and modern, so the need for new solutions arises.Also do we see the need for fibre optic solutions in the modern yacht and how much emphasis is placed on owner ´creature`comforts over kiss principles....

Let the debate begin and once again, great forum!!
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Old 04-16-2009, 01:48 PM   #2 (permalink)
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I doubt we will ever see fiber optics on yachts, the equipment needed at both ends to interpret the signals would take longer than just sending it down a wire. Maybe when the first 300 meter yacht gets built, and the mainframe is at the back, and the owners suite is at the very front, and the owner is editing 3D animations in real time. Never used wifi around carbon though, sorry.
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Old 04-16-2009, 02:01 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Fiber optics have been used on yachts since 20 years. Even on sailboats.
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Old 04-16-2009, 02:24 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Wait, for information or for lighting? For lighting absolutely, but for information it doesn't make any sense.
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Old 04-16-2009, 02:36 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Opcn
Wait, for information or for lighting? For lighting absolutely, but for information it doesn't make any sense.
I am not thinking of fiber-lighting, but controls and communication/information systems.
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Old 04-16-2009, 02:45 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AMG
I am not thinking of fiber-lighting, but controls and communication/information systems.
Why? Sure you might save 200 pounds, but yachts don't exactly put of tremendous EM interference and fiber optic is so vulnerable.

I did overlook control systems, and was thinking purely about computers used for other things, but outside of the relatively minor weight savings (and corrosion if you don't hire someone who knows how to run copper) I simply can't come up with an advantage that fiber has on a yacht over copper.
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Old 04-16-2009, 02:57 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Opcn
Why? Sure you might save 200 pounds, but yachts don't exactly put of tremendous EM interference and fiber optic is so vulnerable.

I did overlook control systems, and was thinking purely about computers used for other things, but outside of the relatively minor weight savings (and corrosion if you don't hire someone who knows how to run copper) I simply can't come up with an advantage that fiber has on a yacht over copper.
There are numerous advantages. One is that you can add controls without building in new wires in precious and tight environments.
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Old 04-16-2009, 02:59 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Well I guess I stand corrected then.

Thanks Lars.
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Old 04-16-2009, 07:27 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AMG
There are numerous advantages. One is that you can add controls without building in new wires in precious and tight environments.
That can be done with wired too......
And the best with fiber is that not current-conducting.

The problem with wlan and carbon is that carbon dampen the signal very good.
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Old 04-16-2009, 11:16 PM   #10 (permalink)
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As to the question of fibre optics - makes excellent sense over 70m. Remember CAT6a is limited to 100m (as I remember but can't remember exactly), bandwidth demands are increasing (AV systems inc. HD video) and the cost of fibre optics is decreasing. Can see quite a rosy future for fibre optics on larger yachts.

As to carbon fibre + wifi interesting question, love to know the answer like you.
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Old 04-16-2009, 11:26 PM   #11 (permalink)
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CAT5 is 100 mbps CAT5E is 1000mbps CAT6 is 1000mbps+

With CAT7A you can run 40 gigabit Ethernet at 40 meters (so 20 at 80M approximately) Higher speeds one directionally. If you are copying a HD video you may have to wait for 18 seconds rather than 6 seconds, however considering the fact that you will have to wait 15 minutes to write that sucker to the drive it is doubtful that you will notice any effect.
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Old 04-17-2009, 12:44 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Well, I'm from IT and not from Yachting...

Today there is an shift from fiber to copper. Copper is cheaper, shielded etc..
Have you ever fixed a broken fiber?

We use fiber between servers, storage networks and network switches.
Fiber will work today with 4 ..10 GBit where CAT7 starts. The dirty last mile is copper, who has PCs and Laptops with a fiber interface ???

I will see copper on the main trail.

And wireless? The speed will increase bute WLAN will never work through metal. You need an infrastructure of managed access points. This is a lot of smoke (energy) in the air.

We will have mixed solutions. In ship with copper, on sun deck wireless.

IMHO
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Old 04-17-2009, 01:02 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ju52
Well, I'm from IT and not from Yachting...We use fiber between servers, storage networks and network switches.
Hi,

This is how the last two new builds I have done have been speced by the AV/IT Suppliers.

There is large resistance from the yards I have dealt with to pulling in a Fibre Backbone, they always cite difficulties in termination as their reason to not want to use it.

We have a survey done close to the end of construction to determine that the initial layout has all areas covered as required and to see if we need any additional units.
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Old 04-17-2009, 02:32 AM   #14 (permalink)
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What I took away from what Lars said was that you don't have to make the components play nice together. There is no way that your monitors and controllers are handling enought information to make copper unrealistic, and lets face it, if you have room for 3/16th worth of fiber you have room for 5/16ths worth of copper.

Also what is the advantage of a non-conductor? If the Yacht has enough EMF to make this an issue you have way bigger problems than fiber versus copper, and you have copper at both ends of fiber anyways.
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Old 04-17-2009, 03:38 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Opcn
I doubt we will ever see fiber optics on yachts
Remember, this was what I commented on. Not if there are better systems around, it is beyond my knowledge.
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