Advice requested for 6-Pak License

cnkale80 · 02-03-2008, 02:18 PM

I served 4 years in the US Coast Guard on board a 378 ft Cutter (the Jarvis out of Hawaii). I was an Operations Specialist and one of my primary duties was radar navigation. I have been getting mixed answers from different training centers about how my time will be counted. I am NAV rules certified, Damage Control certified, and have extensive Search and Rescue experience. I have been off the water for almost 3 years now because I am a full time student so I know that will hurt me some. Can anyone here give me some sort of direction as to what I can do? Thanks!!

johlman · 03-15-2008, 06:39 PM

Call Chapman Schools in Florida. They'll hook you up

cnkale80 · 03-15-2008, 06:42 PM

Hi Johlman. Thank you for your reply. When you say they will hook me up do you mean just help me toward a 6-PAK or hook me up in ways other training centers would not. Thanks again.

sblunden · 03-16-2008, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cnkale80

I served 4 years in the US Coast Guard on board a 378 ft Cutter (the Jarvis out of Hawaii). I was an Operations Specialist and one of my primary duties was radar navigation. I have been getting mixed answers from different training centers about how my time will be counted. I am NAV rules certified, Damage Control certified, and have extensive Search and Rescue experience. I have been off the water for almost 3 years now because I am a full time student so I know that will hurt me some. Can anyone here give me some sort of direction as to what I can do? Thanks!!

Remember that both your total sea time and your RECENT sea time are important numbers (go the USCG web site, Sea School or Grosetti licensing consultant web sites for details). As far as how military sea time is counted, I'm not able to give you a definite answer. I know a guy who served on subs for many years and none of his time was eligible for some obscure reason. You need to call one of the schools (Chapmans, Sea School, Mariners School etc.) or get a professional engaged for that. Just move quickly as the clock is ticking on your most recent time. Hope this didn't confuse things more! Steve.

Marmot · 03-16-2008, 10:42 AM

"Can anyone here give me some sort of direction as to what I can do?"

Your old organization has the answer to every one of your questions and the documents you need to file your application. Everything you need is here:

http://www.uscg.mil/stcw/

Pascal · 03-16-2008, 11:26 AM

it shoudl count towards total sea time but you will need to show some recent time. You ned 360 days of sea time for your OUPV including 90 he past 3 years.

one day is 4 hours under way in a 24 hour period. Anchored doens't count, but drifting does.

i think there is some form you need to get from the USCGT or NAVY for military time to count, your local USCG office shoudl be able to tell you.

cnkale80 · 03-16-2008, 12:00 PM

thanks for your help guys, I appreciate it.

aeronautic1 · 03-20-2008, 04:11 PM

I am a USCG veteran (MK) and used my sea time to get my six pack year ago. I believe the DD214 will show your sea time.

You should consider contacting Maritime Professional Training (www.mptusa.com) and get your RYA/MCA (British) Yachtmaster license if the "white fleet" is your bag, baby. This license will take you places that a USCG license will not and gets you 200 tons instead of 100 tons. You also only need 90 days to qualify.

Did you actually spend 4 years on Javis? I was on Mellon when she was homeported at Sand Island, but that was in the early 70s. Then rotations were 2 years.

Ken Bracewell · 03-20-2008, 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aeronautic1

This license will take you places that a USCG license will not

Where? I'm not sure what you mean by that...

Marmot · 03-20-2008, 09:40 PM

"I believe the DD214 will show your sea time."

It will not. Please go to the USCG licensing site and get the real story from the people you must submit the application to. They have all the correct information and you can download all the forms you need.

"This license will take you places that a USCG license will not ..."

The MCA yacht license scheme is a very limited license and is not recognized anywhere else for anything other than yachting service. Don't waste your time. Use the sea time you have toward a real license that is "portable" and recognized worldwide. The fact that you can get an MCA yachtmaster ticket with less than 2 months sea time should tell you something about how much it is worth. Consider that it takes 540 days to get a USCG AB ticket, what does that say about an MCA master?

If you want a maritime career, get the best ticket your seatime will allow and use that to get a job with MSC or even a tugboat company, anything to get training and experience toward a legitimate license that will serve you the rest of your career. That license can be used on yachts as well. You will gain real seatime faster and have your training paid for. In a few short years you will hold a license that the MCA crowd can't even dream about. You will replace those unqualified people when the new and larger boats come into the industry.

Don't fall for the lure of a quickie license that should be printed on the back of a Cheerios box.

sblunden · 03-21-2008, 06:55 AM

Oh, boy. This is getting testy. I'd like to ask the Yachtmaster people if their certifications allow them to operate US flagged, Coast Guard INSPECTED vessels with more than 6 paying passengers. That's what it all comes down to, in my opinion. I have a couple of customers who charter their USCG inspected 65 footers and carry 10-12 paying passengers. They are required to have current CG inspection certificates and need to sail under US Merchant Marine Master's licenses or equivalents. I see a lot of transients with MCA certificates but don't really know what their legal authority is.

Anyone have a definitive answer to this question? Thanks.

Marmot · 03-21-2008, 07:47 AM

"I see a lot of transients with MCA certificates but don't really know what their legal authority is."

An MCA certificate is not valid on U.S. flagged vessels of any description. An MCA yacht certificate is not valid on anything other than a yacht.

The only USCG license an alien can hold is an OUPV (operator of uninspected passenger vessels - commonly called a 6-pak) under 5 tons. Even then the holder must be a legal immigrant and hold a "green card."

The definitive answer is supplied on the coast guard licensing web site. "Testy?" Maybe, but for good reason, this is a business that is founded on a lot of regulations and procedures, some that might seem silly or useless but they are part of the toolkit that a competent master or other licensed officer must have available and know how and when to use. If someone can't even research how to obtain a license, what will that person do when critical information is required to operate safely?

You don't have to know everything but you have a duty to know where to find information and know how to use it. "I believe the DD214 will show your sea time."is like saying "I believe the water ahead of us is deep enough" rather than look at a chart ...

Come on guys, if you want to be professionals you have to start thinkiing and acting like professionals and not 50 day wonders.

sblunden · 03-21-2008, 08:29 AM

With all due respect, the statement that the MCA Yachtmaster cert is not valid on commercial vessels is incorrect. Visiting the RYA web site http://www.ryatraining.org/professio...dorsements.htm I noted that the MCA (UK equivalent of the US Coast Guard) recognizes Yachtmastster commercial endorsements (including STCW) on British flagged vessels. This puts a commercially endorsed MCA Yachtmaster ticket on par with my USCG Merchant Marine 100GT Master's license, unless I'm missing something here? Best, Steve.

Marmot · 03-21-2008, 09:21 AM

http://www.ryatraining.org/professio...dorsements.htm reads:

"The standard commercial endorsement allows you work on board British flagged vessels which are subject to the MCA’s codes of practice for small commercial vessels. The following wording would appear on your certificate:"

"For Yachtmaster® Offshore and Yachtmaster Ocean certificates of competence: “This certificate is valid for use as a Master of yachts of up to 200gt on commercially and privately registered yachts until (date of expiry)”

“The certificate holder complies with STCW 95 regulations V1/1 Sections V1/1-4. This certificate is valid for use as a Master of yachts of up to 200gt on commercially and privately registered yachts until (date of expiry)”

Yacht means yacht, a vessel with a certificate describing it as a yacht, holding a manning certificate (if applicable) describing it as a yacht.

A USCG 100 ton master can legally operate a yacht, a head boat, a ferry, or any other commercial vessel of not more than 100 tons. It is not restricted to yacht service. In real life a 100 ton is not worth much as it is not an internationally recognized license so the point is moot really. A 200 ton master with an oceans endorsement is about the minimum valid for international service if you want to swim in the yacht pool.

aeronautic1 · 04-02-2008, 06:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marmot

http://www.ryatraining.org/professio...dorsements.htm reads:

"The standard commercial endorsement allows you work on board British flagged vessels which are subject to the MCA’s codes of practice for small commercial vessels. The following wording would appear on your certificate:"

"For Yachtmaster® Offshore and Yachtmaster Ocean certificates of competence: “This certificate is valid for use as a Master of yachts of up to 200gt on commercially and privately registered yachts until (date of expiry)”

“The certificate holder complies with STCW 95 regulations V1/1 Sections V1/1-4. This certificate is valid for use as a Master of yachts of up to 200gt on commercially and privately registered yachts until (date of expiry)”

Yacht means yacht, a vessel with a certificate describing it as a yacht, holding a manning certificate (if applicable) describing it as a yacht.

A USCG 100 ton master can legally operate a yacht, a head boat, a ferry, or any other commercial vessel of not more than 100 tons. It is not restricted to yacht service. In real life a 100 ton is not worth much as it is not an internationally recognized license so the point is moot really. A 200 ton master with an oceans endorsement is about the minimum valid for international service if you want to swim in the yacht pool.

Well Marmot, seeing as the title of this web site is YACHT FORUMS, and everything we discuss here is YACHT ORIENTED, then why would we even consider work on a commerical fishing boat or lighter. Have you considered posting on TUG FORUMS?

With the majority of yachts over 100 feet being foreign flagged, then an MCA license holds water. Especially if it charters. When was the last time you had to perform practical factors exam at sea for a USCG 100 ton ticket? Do you hold an RYA/MCA license? Because I hold both US and MCA and the MCA exam was far tougher than the USCG exam.

I stand correct on the DD214 issue... it's been a while. There is a Sea Service record that the Coast Guard issues with the discharge papers. If you do not have a copy, you can get one from the NPRC at http://www.archives.gov/veterans/mil...e-records.html