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Missing yacht "Nina" presumed sunk off New Zealand

Discussion in 'General Yachting Discussion' started by K1W1, Jun 29, 2013.

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  1. K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

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    Hi,

    Saw this the other day, there has been no good news since in spite of massive aerial searches by two countries.

    BBC News - Missing yacht Nina 'presumed sunk' off New Zealand
  2. NYCAP123

    NYCAP123 Senior Member

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    I've been following this for awhile. Fairly certain and very sad. I'm surprised that no signal was received from the EPIRB.
  3. K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

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    Hi,

    I read somewhere the EPIRB was stowed inside the boat so it might have gone down with the boat if it all happened quickly.

    I also heard some US news reader saying they might have made it ashore.

    I seriously doubt it from where they were last reported to be.

    The area where they vanished can be tricky at any time of year, it is especially treacherous in the winter which is about mid term right now.

    There have been a good number of folks who have sailed halfway round the world and got into serious problems in this stretch of water.

    The famous cruising yachtsman Eric Hiscock is said to have described it as similar to the Bay of Biscay but 1200 miles wide.

    One never knows though, folks have been given up as lost before and been found months later.

    Here is just one of them. Rose Noelle - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
  4. NYCAP123

    NYCAP123 Senior Member

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    That is indeed a treacherous stretch of ocean from everything I've heard (yet I've heard friends of these people say they weren't expecting a hard crossing), and there is always hope. We've all heard some amazing tales of survival. So we hope.
    It truly is amazing how many people will spend the money to get an EPIRB and then either not register it or, as you say, store it someplace where it can't float off. Hopefully this mention will educate at least one boater. Too many people buy things so they can brag that they have it. Your equipment is nothing but a waste of money unless you know how to use it, and use it properly. I'm always amazed how many boaters hide their PFDs inside a bag and tucked into an interior closet or such. Folks, a boat can overturn or sink in a matter of moments. A fire on board may prevent you from getting to any area of your boat besides right where you are. Always know exactly where to look to find your latitude and longitude and know how to deploy ALL of your emergency equipment. You will NOT be able to put on your PFD once in the water. There's a reason boats carry more than just a spare tire. You and your gear may well be your first and only line of defense in an emergency.
  5. NYCAP123

    NYCAP123 Senior Member

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    Sails shreded

    Apparently a text was received from the boat on the day they vanished. saying the sails had been shreded and they had bare masts. Leaves me to wonder about whether they carried a spare set of sails. Wouldn't that be standard on a vessel this size making a journey like this? Between this and no EPIRB or sat phone signal I'm getting the feeling that this vessel wasn't prepared for what they may encounter.

    Final SMS: Sails 'shredded' on missing American schooner - World News
  6. MBevins

    MBevins Senior Member

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    I read on one of the sailing forums that the EPIRB on board was a manual deployment type. As to the sails, they would have multiple sails onboard but they may not have been in a position to set anything new if the weather was bad enough to shred what was already in place.
    I was once caught in a storm where we had 60knot winds for 12hrs. Within the first hour we were down to the storm jib, the boom was lashed to the deck and we were still doing 14kts. The storm jib started to tear at the clew had it let go entirely we'd have been toast as putting up another jib would have been almost impossible in those conditions.
    So if Nina lost her sails in a storm in the Southern Ocean I'd be surprised if she survived.
  7. K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

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    Hi,

    As she was not sailing in the Southern Ocean I do not think there is much chance of it being a storm there that did the damage.
  8. Fishtigua

    Fishtigua Senior Member

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    I agree, once the wind speed goes to 'sod-off' numbers, no one is going on deck to change sails. It's downright dangerous. You just drop them and run under bare poles.

    On delivery once on a 1901 90ft ketch, the weather went from a bit breezy to a full Force 9 to 10 rapidly in the night. Sails split, thick rigging parts went BANG across the deck. Even the solid 1 1/2" stainless belaying pins bent like red licorice laces.

    You are in the hands of the gods.
  9. MBevins

    MBevins Senior Member

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    I was referring to the general area
  10. K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

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    Hi,

    If that is the case please show me where the Sthn Ocean is located North Of New Zealand.

    The lighthouse at the top of NZ on Cape Reinga is at 34 deg 26 mins south

    Nina would have had to sail up the east coast and turn left leaving this headland some distance on the portside as it headed towards Australia.

    From Wikipedia.

    The Southern Ocean (also known as the Great Southern Ocean, Antarctic Ocean, South Polar Ocean and Austral Ocean) comprises the southernmost waters of the World Ocean, generally taken to be south of 60°S latitude and encircling Antarctica.[1]
  11. MBevins

    MBevins Senior Member

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    OK already , come to the Great Lakes and let's compare knowledge.
  12. Pascal

    Pascal Senior Member

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    The message said the "storm sails were shredded". That must have been their smallest sails, I m sure they had larger sails stored below.

    Sad end to a beautiful boat!
  13. K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

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  14. jhall767

    jhall767 Senior Member

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    It has been reported they had a manual deploy epirb. If true is there any justification for not having an automatic deploy on their epirb? Mine is a a hydrostatic release so simply getting it wet won't release it. Hate to think it was just for a couple of hundred dollars.
  15. Marmot

    Marmot Senior Member

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    It never ceases to amaze what people will do to save a couple of dollars. Another site that caters to the slow boat crowd recently had a thread about 4 guys with no experience delievering a new (to them) boat from Puget Sound to the Bay Area. They had 3 exposure suits among them, no raft but according to one of the volunteer delivery crew, the owner said he would rent one for the trip.

    Some discussion came up about the wisdom of some of the decisions and the owner chimed in with the reason for changing his mind about renting a raft was the shipping cost to return it from the Bay Area to Seattle. Ya really got to wonder sometimes ...
  16. 84far

    84far Senior Member

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    Snapped/lose a plank... would of gone down real quick, by the look of the photo, she didn't look to good. Cheers

    Far
  17. K1W1

    K1W1 Senior Member

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    Hi,

    Far- You might not be "far" from the mark with those words given what's just been posted online in NZ.

    Lost Yacht Nina An Unsafe 'Lead Mine' - national | Stuff.co.nz

    3 yrs of no docking,I wonder how much of a feast the worms had had, sounds like the Skipper should have learnt something from the Bounty Tragedy.

    NZ should instigate a CAT 1 Survey regime for all vessels leaving NZ just as it does for those with the NZ Flag on the back.
  18. NYCAP123

    NYCAP123 Senior Member

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    This CAT1 Survey requirement sounds interesting. I'd never heard of that requirement. Do any other countries require it for non-commercial vessels? It certainly sounds like lack of maintenance, planning and emergency equipment, combined with hell on the seas, caused this tragedy.
  19. Marmot

    Marmot Senior Member

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    "... sailed by a traditionalist skipper who refused to have "gadgets" aboard ..."

    And died in the traditional manner.

    Like the idiot who sank the Bounty, those guys honestly believe they are different than those who went to the bottom on old and poorly maintained sailing ships. They have been drowning that way for a thousand years and are not likely to stop in this century either.
  20. NYCAP123

    NYCAP123 Senior Member

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    Some people believe that how you live is more important than how long you live. Some trust tradition and experience more than gadgets. I've been on many boats where the owners had every new gadget that came on the market, and didn't have a clue what to do with any of them. Which is worse? As for poor maintenance, if I could only count so high the number of fancy boats I've been aboard to find oil and trash filled bilges and blocked bilge pumps. That in no way exonerates this skipper. Personally I think he screwed up in several ways. But I can also understand thinking that a boat that's been sailing for 90 years will complete its next voyage.
    As for the Bounty's captain, I have nothing but respect for him. However, he screwed up and it cost him his ship and his life as well as a crew member's. This is a business where you often only get to make one mistake. I'm extremely hesitant to condemn a captain who goes down with his ship and is no longer around to defend himself.