[SAB]

Originally Posted by Marmot

The figures I posted on the size of an array required to power a 2500kW yacht were based on at first, 40 percent conversion efficiency, and lastly at a whopping and for now unobtainable 90 percent and the area is still over half that of an American football field.

Hmmm, this is where things went totally off course- post #63 para 5.. 'if you are claiming...' If you can show me where I started claiming that yachts will run on solar power in 2015 i'll be happy to keep responding.

[Codger]

Originally Posted by Marmot

But, if we could convert fantasy and fervor into energy we could run several large yachts off the LiPo and solar crowd. If we recruited the aircar guys we could power the entire Med season.

Marmot, Shhh!. You don't want to scare them away! If they figure out that the nice little round portholes just above the waterline on some newbuilds are actually just holes with hidden oarlocks and retractable mounted 3 man oars waiting to be manned by the above mentioned fervent "volunteers" they might run away and we'll have to resort to diesel to move about.

[Marmot]

Originally Posted by SAB

Hmmm, this is where things went totally off course- post #63 para 5.. 'if you are claiming...' If you can show me where I started claiming that yachts will run on solar power in 2015 i'll be happy to keep responding.

The whole quote should have been "if you are claiming or believe... " If you don't then there isn't a problem.

[Opcn]

I absolutely agree with Lars.

As for NYCAP123's comment; I do not think that anything I said should make anyone think that diesel is on its way out. Until someone comes up with a small efficient nuclear power device that would be appropriate for a 50 M yacht some oil derivative or replacement is going to be key. I'm just talking about the periphery, the little things that will change.

In 6 years you will not be able to buy new flatscreen TV's that use as much electricity as todays do. Incandescent bulbs are going to be completely out of the picture and solid LED systems will be cheaper and easier and look better. They will produce less heat and as a result will mean less AC will be needed.

Looking at things from purely a luxury stand point, do your 50M yachts run completely silently? I've never been on a MY that was completely silent, with a generator running you may have as much as 45 db in some parts of the yacht, Batteries are dead silent. If just for the sake of a happier crew some people will be installing the new battery systems, which, after they get even smaller will get a whole lot cheaper too (the mining is the most expensive part of battery manufacture, 10% of the lithium probably means 80% less cost a $50K system would be cost effective, and could mean that you run your gens for 15 minutes 3 times a night instead of all night long).

There are some other cool Nanotech things, Nantennas are one, you can make an antenna that grabs IR, and emboss it into a thin plastic film, if they figure out how to change the frequency they can power a room off the heat bouncing around in it, i.e. you get an air conditioner that doesn't dry the air and pumps out electricity rather than using it, freezers and refrigerators too (although a freezer would probably still need some help).

Composites would be a lot stronger if they had fibers going perpendicular to the weave, but the fibers we had were too big and squeezed out the resin, well with a modest 1% increase in weight and 10% cost increase you can mix carbon nanotubes into the resin, since the diameter is 1/1000th of the carbon fibers they can happily rest in the gaps in the weave and hold the different plies together very tightly, increasing strength 10 fold. Even if this were just a wear strip along a keel it would be a heck of a lot safer.

They can etch nanowires alon a semiconductor block, and make little pockets, in 10 years we will probably have supercomputers that use 20 kW and exabyte hardrives that are the size of modern hard drives. OLED screens are just amazing, they are thin and crystal clear, and very power efficient (unlike LCD screens that blast light through the screen that blocks it out).

This thread would be so much more fun if it were 26 years out instead of 6 years out.

[YachtForums]

This was sent by YF member Brian Eiland...

A project by PlanetSolar to design and construct a solar catamaran that will be used to circumnavigate the globe during a 25,000-mile, 120-day journey in 2010. The company, based in Germany, will use stops during the trip to promote renewable energy and solar power.

At first I wondered, why does a sailboat need solar power? After all, sailboats under sail are the ultimate green vehicles. But then the words “dead calm” leapt into my mind. And, when there’s no cloud cover it certainly is pretty sunny on the ocean.

PlanetSolar is using several products from Autodesk to design the boat including Digital Prototyping features in Autodesk Inventor that will help visualize the impact of design changes. The engineers are also using AutoCAD Electrical and Autodesk Productstream.

Here’s a YouTube video about the project.

Website: http://www.planetsolar.org/bateau.en.php

[NYCAP123]

Originally Posted by YachtForums

This was sent by YF member Brian Eiland...

Interesting, but um "sailboat"?

[Marmot]

Originally Posted by Marmot

There are real benefits to cleaning up exhaust emissions, reducing or eliminating wastewater discharges, and experimenting with new technologies for publicity or charter marketing purposes but don't kid yourself about a green revolution in the large yacht business.

I don't see any sails either and I certainly don't see the future of yachting looking anything like that hocky puck on skids.

[NYCAP123]

Originally Posted by Marmot

I don't see any sails either and I certainly don't see the future of yachting looking anything like that hocky puck on skids.

Yachting encompasses not only the "large yacht business", but the medium and small self-crewed and chartered yachts as well as dinner, tour and other commercial yachts. Who but Gene Roddenberry imagined half of what we call everyday essentials today. Just a few years ago I wouldn't have envisioned "A" or Oracle or the Maltese Falcon. I still remember Eddie Murphy's reaction in Beverly hills cop to the way those guys in LA were dressed. Now that's everywhere. I do agree that I'd not expect to see many (any) large yachts looking like that by 2015, but the future is a very interesting place.

[orion]

Originally Posted by Windswept

An open question...maybe a discussion on the scope of the industry and the changes in yacht construction would be useful at this time.

Any takers?

Maybe like this ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=23phT7quZ6w

[Seafarer]

Originally Posted by orion

Maybe like this ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=23phT7quZ6w

docking that on a wet day looks like it would be an adventure for any crew who have to walk the side decks.

[NYCAP123]

Line handling as an x-treme sport.

[Marmot]

Originally Posted by NYCAP123

Yachting encompasses not only the "large yacht business", but the medium and small self-crewed and chartered yachts as well as dinner, tour and other commercial yachts.

I believe we are less likely to see major changes in the smaller yachts as the costs involved to install future-tech gadgets are so much higher in proportion.

Like I wrote earlier, the retired couple cruising their 65 foot trawler aren't gong to invest an extra million or three just to dock quietly or to eliminate the need for a better sound shield over the generator. And they certainly aren't going to spend another million to save $50K over their period of ownership.

The reason we see so many small boats with this stuff clagged on is because as a technology demonstrator it makes for a cheaper platform and when the publicity rush is over it can be removed and the boat sold off with conventional systems restored or it can be junked to preclude the embarassment of what if looks like in a couple of years.

[Opcn]

A couple on a 65 foot trawler that needs a 2 MW system would be rare. a $100K system that lets them sleep in silence all right and saves them 4 gallons of inefficincy a night would probably be worth it to most people. Heck there are already a lot of people who live in sail boats with little solar panels to run some light bulbs.

You need to come up for a solid reason why more people will not be using these systems as they get cheaper (by large factors) smaller, easier to find and install, more trendy, more efficient, more environmentally friendly, more reliable, and fuel prices rise.

[NYCAP123]

Although what you said is absolutely true you may have noticed a bit of a contradiction between your 1st & 3rd paragraphs.

I believe we are less likely to see major changes in the smaller yachts as the costs involved to install future-tech gadgets are so much higher in proportion.

The reason we see so many small boats with this stuff clagged on is because as a technology demonstrator it makes for a cheaper platform

Although there is an initial outlay, a lot of these cruisers (not the 65' and up so much as the 65' and down) look more on the cruising costs. On the ICW I see many boats that look like they should be put to sleep and there's thousands of dollars in solar arrays, wind generators and the like. As the boats get bigger they are usually more exact with their cost/benefit analysis and more long term in their thinking. So, is it possible that one day the entire roof structure of a large yacht will be some sort of fashionable solar collector? I'm not Gene Roddenberry, but I've seen a lot of things that my father would have never though possible. So I guess we'll just wait and see. (What's a man's average lifespan these days? )

[Marmot]

Originally Posted by NYCAP123

Although what you said is absolutely true you may have noticed a bit of a contradiction between your 1st & 3rd paragraphs.

No, not really any contradiction. Technology demonstrators are often scaled versions or built on off-the-shelf platforms that are affordable. There is little if any consideration given to the commericial or economic viablility of the demonstrator. This is quite common in the commercial and military marine industries.