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New Age Trawler/Motorsailer; Kite assisted PowerYacht

 
 
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Old 05-28-2009, 11:58 AM   #31
brian eiland
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Learning from the Youth

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..Now we come to a new era, and again it’s the ‘fringe’ sailing youngsters that show us another way…kite sailing.
...from another forum
Quote:
Originally Posted by sigurd

Location: norway

Just came down from the snow dunes of Hardangervidda playing with my new Flysurfer Speed 2 10m and a little review:

My former kites were all Peter Lynn Phantoms, these are ARC ram air closed cell kites. Only four lines all the way to the kite, like many inflated kites (tube kites), unlike the FS which have an intricate bridle like a paraglider. The phantoms are out of prod. but were the most efficient PL's mass produced AFAIK, due to the high aspect ratio. Due to the lack of bridle, tangles are nothing compared to the FS, when it happens.

Both are water relauncheable, so suitable for boats. The FS has a lot higher CL, means much more power per area. In the snow it is useable from almost walking pace wind. Phantoms require more.
Have not met FS top end yet, but the depower is quite astounding. It comes in a lighter fabric as well as the standard, making it even better for light winds.

Much more powerful than phantom 12 and steers quicker. Much more direct throttle - a two edged sword, since the mushyness of the Ph. is part of what makes it so great in gusts - it eats them and gives the rider a safer feeling. FS is more prone to luffing/overflying and collapsing at the edge of the wind window, in slight wind changes. It requires much more attention than the Ph. The Ph, as will most the arcs, will fly to zenith if you let go the control bar - nice feature for chatting or smoking, cutting hole in the ice for a drink etc.

The safety release to one line of the Ph is very safe and nice, it will go to ground like a flag and pull very little.

On four lines the safety release and landing system of the FS is inadequate, IMO. It will flog around like a bat (out of hell) on a string and make a terrible mess, if there is much wind. The pull can meanwhile be on the border of too much for retrieving the kite unless you have an achor point for it and can walk down to the kite. There is a fifth line system for this kite that I want to try, said to make a better release system.

Both has one way valves in the leading edge to make them suitable for water.
The FS has overpressure valves to protect it when crashing. I have blown a cell in the phantom 6 when crashing, earlier.
Both seem rugged and well built, ARCs have short sticks at the tips.

To extrapolate this to kite sailing, I believe these are both superb for that. The phantoms are much easier to fly, but will require acres of kite for a big boat. Probably the newer, lower aspect PL synergy is even easier to fly, has more power to to the area, more guaranteed water relaunch and may have a similar depower. As I see it upwind power is a major issue for kite boats - the phantom 12 is like nothing compared to an 8sqm una-rig - upwind.

Side note, the jumps with the speed2 is just frackin amaiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiizing.
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Old 05-31-2009, 12:15 PM   #32
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Slender Tri-hull, BIG size

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..I have been following some of the ‘slender ship’ technology as it has cross-over potential with multihull technologies. For a few references, visit these websites, and see a few of the attachments I’ve provided. There is considerably more reference material available.
1) Worlds Largest Powered Trimaran
2) White Rabbit tri
(see also here)
3) Very Slender Vessel, VSV
(see also here)
4) Cable & Wireless Trimaran
...slender ship ?... on another scale
EOSEAS, greenship concept born from the ECORIZON program
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RkFFLMTkNks

...this is a little bit larger tri-hull than anticipated for the new-age-trawler-motorsailer ...but interesting how she makes use of that extra wide deck area available
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Old 05-31-2009, 12:30 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brian eiland
...slender ship ?... on another scale
EOSEAS, greenship concept born from the ECORIZON program
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RkFFLMTkNks

...this is a little bit larger tri-hull than anticipated for the new-age-trawler-motorsailer ...but interesting how she makes use of that extra wide deck area available

Hi,

You were beaten to it by Orion yesterday.

http://www.yachtforums.com/forums/ge...soon-here.html
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Cheers,

K1W1
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Old 06-18-2009, 09:12 PM   #34
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Humphrey's Skysail Brochure, PDF file reference update

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...Back to those design concept drawings by Humphrey’s (attached PDF).
LINK
Upon review I just discovered that this link I posted previously is no longer valid. So I thought I would give a new one since the PDF file is too large to attach in this forum::
http://www.skysails.info/fileadmin/u...s_Brochure.pdf
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Old 08-31-2009, 01:17 PM   #35
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Econo Version Tri-hull Power with backup sail

Interesting posting this morning on what might be termed an economy model cruising tri-hull configuration powered craft with an aux lateen sail in place of a kite.

http://www.yachtforums.com/forums/84017-post66.html

..similar theme

...but this one can be shipped to its cruising ground rather than getting there on its own bottom.
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Old 10-06-2009, 08:33 PM   #36
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Littoral Ship Tri-hull

Look at the minimal bow waves and wakes of this tri-hull design at speed

More photos here
Attached Images
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Old 10-16-2009, 01:13 PM   #37
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Gino Morrelli Endorses Kite Power

I found this interview in a recent issue of Sea Horse Magazine. They are speaking with Gino Morelli of Melvin/Morrelli Design



SeaHorseMag: You’re given a clean sheet of paper and asked to design your ultimate multihull...

GinoMorrelli: For me right now it would be a powercat! My personal solution is into powerboats due in part to the fact that I have a wife, kids, a business and a schedule. Sailing is now a luxury I can’t really afford. But if I could guarantee I could go 18-20 kts anywhere any time with a sailboat, then I could almost live a life afloat.

The one thing I can see coming is what could be called the SUV of sailing. There are a lot of cool things going on with drives right now. The aim is to retract, remove, or eliminate the drive when we don’t need it. The problem we currently face is that if we put the right engine in to go 20kts, then the hull shape is wrong. That’s led to tough compromises, but if we can make the power plants lighter, and get rid of the drag of propulsion when we’re under sail, then I can see us ending up with a 20kt boat… it will do 20kt under sail, 20kt under power, and it’s going to be fairly user-friendly all the time.

I also like the thought of kite sails I think ultimately that’s a way to be able to get a high-power low-risk sail plan. The trick is going to be making it auto-pilotable. There’s a bunch of guys working on it, in fact we’re scheduled to test one on one of out Leopard 47 production boats that we’ll soon be delivering from the builders in Cape Town to Tortola. The Moorings is auditioning a couple of guys to build a kite to help reduce fuel costs for their deliveries so we have been fooling around with some of those guys, trying to figure out how we can make this happen and stick it on autopilot. The pilot would control the angle of attack and let us fly the kite day and night

Plus you need to have a simple launch and recovery system... There are some bizarre kite guys out there fooling around with some different designs that have promise. It's just a matter of getting some funding for them so they can build prototypes. The shipping industry is actually pushing the limit of kites a little faster than the recreational side, so we may see some of this development come out of the shipping industry because they have a lot of reasons to get some power out of the wind.
__________________________________________________ ______

SeaHorseMag: And what about your pure performance multihulls.

GinoMorrelli: From here on it’s going to be a horses-for-courses thing. If you’re looking at the next generation of multi to break the round-the-world record as opposed to a single-handed transatlantic, then obviously Hydroptère is where you should look. It’s opening up a giant crack and showing us that it you can spend enough money and are diligent enough then you’re on your way. They are going to get that thing to stay together one of these days, and it’s going to break the 24-hour record and the Atlantic record. And there are some dudes telling you that thing could go round the world one of these days — if you have enough time and money to develop it, foils are definitely the way to go.. it’s an instant turbo. We’re still not sure what exactly that boat’s gonna be — a foil-borne biplane cat or tri, or a foil-borne, wingmasted, tilted bi-plane ‘thing’.

I also have these crazy visions of a big foil-borne, kite-driven, ultra-light three person boat. That’s where the programming and the software for the autopilot for the kite come into play. It’s where you set a ginormous kite then tell it never to develop more than 20,000lb lift. You’d probably control it by just making it drive at a different angle of attack. It’s gonna happen
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Old 11-12-2009, 01:02 AM   #38
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HISWA Symposium on Yacht Design...paper on kite propulsion

HISWA Symposium on Yacht Design...paper on kite propulsion


http://www.hiswasymposium.com/pdf/2009/Hiswa%20Symposium%202008%20Tom%20Schnackenberg.pdf

http://www.hiswasymposium.com/symposium_papers.asp
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