[FISHTIGUA]

Oh dear, a bit in the newspapers today says that not only is Fiat(owners of Ferrari/Maserati/Alfa/Lancia) is totally debt-ridden but also that Ferretti has had slow payment and cancelled orders, a large part of Italian GDP will be lost for the next year. It should not be just an auto bail-out that is needed but also a marine one too in the E.U.

Yesterday Jaguar/LandRover along with GM Europe and Honda/Nissan UK got a sort of bail-out, with some real tiny smallprint, was made available but nobody could understand it. The lawyers are working on it overnight, god bless'em, that makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside.

[SHAZAM!]

Lets put all the BS and speculation aside. I inspected the 63 in question in person, the news is not good. What you see on the port side is only a small part of the problem, the starboard side is as bad. It just hasn't ripped apart yet. There are lamination and general construction issues that are INCOMPREHENSIBLE. If I was a 63 owner (or for that matter if I owned ANY bertram built in the last ten years) I would have a surveyor check the entire hull, sound the hull, take moisture readings and get some core samples just to be safe. I can't say much more but you can put to rest once and for all the rumors that the boat hit something causing this delamination, that is CERTAINLY not the case.

[NYCAP123]

you can put to rest once and for all the rumors that the boat hit something causing this delamination,

Judging from Fishtigua's post just before this I'd guess that speculation is a long way from put to rest. But I that's what lawyers are for right.

[SHAZAM!]

Originally Posted by NYCAP123

But I that's what lawyers are for right.

They're on this like white on rice, the fine bar members that I saw at the boat all had $$$$$$$$$$$$ signs in their eyes.

[SandEngXp]

It is quite obvious that un-bonds (vs. dis-bonds being something that was previously bonded ) at the core-skin interface just above the chine are present. This over stresses the outer skin (multiple plys of solid fiberglass not properly adhered together) resulting in large areas of delamination.

Poor engineering, materials and/or poor workmanship are hazardous. Remember the Titanic, a steel vessel - it however did not make its way back to port safely....

[n4nln]

talk about an advertisement for building with epoxy...

-mo

[FISHTIGUA]

Originally Posted by SandEngXp

It is quite obvious that un-bonds (vs. dis-bonds being something that was previously bonded ) at the core-skin interface just above the chine are present. This over stresses the outer skin (multiple plys of solid fiberglass not properly adhered together) resulting in large areas of delamination.

Poor engineering, materials and/or poor workmanship are hazardous. Remember the Titanic, a steel vessel - it however did not make its way back to port safely....

Thank you, please read my replys on page 1, hastily written; it was one of those fast moving threads. Looking at the laminate, as most of the guys at the yard now have, where is the woven roving? You may as well have a chopped-strand gun and a chuck it and hope engineering attitude.

[SandEngXp]

Originally Posted by FISHTIGUA

Thank you, please read my replys on page 1, hastily written; it was one of those fast moving threads. Looking at the laminate, as most of the guys at the yard now have, where is the woven roving? You may as well have a chopped-strand gun and a chuck it and hope engineering attitude.

This is a knit biaxial laminate not woven. The free strands you see in the photo confirm this. Most likely 24 to 36 oz/yd^2 and most likely 2 plys with 3/4 oz/ft^2 mat between, plus 2-4 oz/ft^2 of mat skin coat. The 'core' was bedded using putty. This would be typical of a err on the heavy side comprimise hull side lay-up for this size vessel.

I agree with you last sentence.

[taksan]

This is really really useful information as I was seriously considering signing a contract this week for a 63'

[waburpee]

Does anyone know the surveyor who attended this vessel?

[Buckeye David]

this example shows why large manufacturing companies are going down the tubes like Ferritti. Quality is not an issue. Small private held manufacturing companys who care about quality and reputation RULE. these large companies may show $ on the balance sheet but do not provide the knowledgeable boater with the quality required-- are doomed. please support small ( less than 20 boats per year companies) and buy from a small builder who cares about your investment and your safety.

[SHAZAM!]

Originally Posted by waburpee

Does anyone know the surveyor who attended this vessel?

The boat was not surveyed when it was new, it was surveyed by a GANG of surveyors and naval architects/engineers this week.

[Capt J]

Originally Posted by waburpee

Does anyone know the surveyor who attended this vessel?

Malcolm Elliot surveyed it after this happened (I was told), he has a great reputation as a marine surveyor.

[SandEngXp]

"SHAZAM!

Lets put all the BS and speculation aside. I inspected the 63 in question in person, the news is not good. What you see on the port side is only a small part of the problem, the starboard side is as bad. It just hasn't ripped apart yet. There are lamination and general construction issues that are INCOMPREHENSIBLE. If I was a 63 owner (or for that matter if I owned ANY bertram built in the last ten years) I would have a surveyor check the entire hull, sound the hull, take moisture readings and get some core samples just to be safe. I can't say much more but you can put to rest once and for all the rumors that the boat hit something causing this delamination, that is CERTAINLY not the case"

Most of this is obvious from the photos except the extent the rest of the hull is affected. I have to say that this boat did hit something... ...water.

[SandEngXp]

sea mount at 500' +/- below surface.