[YachtForums]

Originally Posted by airship

On the one side, I appreciate that certain websites need the stats in order to attract (or justify) advertising revenues in order to finance their activities.

Yes, but there are limitations and exclusions. For example, there’s a whole crop of one-page sites that have popped up with no useful or relevant information. They are simply vehicles for Google’s AdWords program and they are cluttering the net. On the flip side, there are live, continuously updated sites that are bringing useful information to all of us. I have my favorites and so do you. These sites require as much work to publish as a full-blown magazine, but are far more technical. Oh yeah… the hours a longer too. Ask me how I know.

Originally Posted by airship

On another side, the whole internet advertising boom and the resulting multi-billion dollar enterprises that have resulted, are nothing more than the outcome of an almighty scam...IMHO that is?!

I’m obviously a little prejudice, but I see your point and it’s valid. The Internet was founded on a completely different set of values, as a military communications network and a tool to connect research facilities and universities. And you’re right, almost everything is exploited for the almighty dollar and… given the value of the medium, the Internet is no exception.

If we set aside the fact that the Internet is not tangible (only virtual) then we must recognize it’s most powerful, underlying common denominator… collective knowledge. Knowledge has value. We have always paid for this, whether it is books, magazines, school or mistakes. It’s hard to put a price on the information that is readily available to us now, and I believe this is one of the primary reason that forums are so popular.

Originally Posted by airship

I mean, I almost never click on an advertiser's link. If I'm in the market to buy, I prefer to do my own research first...

Most of the time, I find banners an annoyance and an eyesore. Like you, I usually don’t click on banners either, because they are often irrelevant to my interest. But… if they are properly presented and conducive to the subject, they can sometimes be complimentary. BTW, this is one of the reasons why we DON’T allow flash banners, or “outside” advertisers, or banners that look like billboards! I will admit… I’ll click on a banner if I have a specific interest and it may lead to further discovery, but I generally don’t like marketers pushing their wares on me.

Because of this, I’ve made a clear point to every advertiser on YF… if they want exposure, they can forget Flash and Billboards. If they are concerned with “Click-Thru” rate, then they have poor vision and questionable marketing smarts. Like you said, it’s not always about stats and all the marketing directors I work with understand this. They’re here to support a community because they learn from you and they’ve recognized the importance of the feedback, the opinions and the experience that owners & users can provide. I have to tell you… we have several reps/directors of major shipyards onboard this site and NOT ONE of them has ever taken a shameless plug. I’ve even seen some of them suggesting another builder because it would best suit the needs of the customer.

Getting back to banners, I’m going to elaborate on this and if you care to read, I’m pretty sure this is going to be an eye-opener. Banners don’t work on many websites, unless the site is a true portal, or has been properly optimized, or has become well propagated within a sector. A few people have heard me mention that YF is a portal 1st, a magazine 2nd and a forum 3rd. Due to the coding behind YF, a lot of traffic is finding the site when they use search engines to look for information on yachts. It appears the majority of our traffic is specifically interested in yachts because we have a good click-thru rate AND because unrelated banners have not performed well. For example, we recently brought on a marine travel insurance company. Short of being a builder, they were a decent fit for YF, however the number of people who chose to visit their website was low in comparison… even though they were receiving the same level of exposure.

Originally Posted by airship

When it comes to advertising on forums (like this one), if I was spending my own money, I'd be more interested that the forum attracted the right mix of readership and contributors who'd be interested in my products. Far more than any thick binder of stats of "views per page etc.

Agreed! This has been an interesting dilemma. For the past 3 years, I’ve been a little baffled by the lack of forum participation, but I’ve recently begun to understand why. I've had some discussions with other admins on this subject. It was the concensus that banners re-direct a lot of traffic. Also, YF is a bit different than most forums. A younger, more net savvy crowd populates many forums. In the case of yacht owners, they are often a bit older, with businesses to run and due to time constraints or security reasons, choose to follow along quietly.

I also agree that readership and contributors are important keys in attracting the right… readership and contributors! Kind of a self-fulfilling prophesy? We’ve all worked to create a helpful environment, but ultimately people want to be among their peers. If all we did was discuss the top 20 largest yachts in the world, how many people can relate to this or would want to join in? If we were all just enthusiasts and never owned a yacht, would we possess the knowledge that real yacht owners are looking for? These questions actually touch on one of my pet peeves… when an admin and/or editor of a magazine/forum has no experience in yacht ownership, navigation, construction or engineering. There’s something seriously wrong with that equation!

Originally Posted by airship

The day may come when advertisers somehow know for sure that the reason why they sold whatever they did was because of a 100% traceable link back to someone's website at the conclusion of the sale. But I guess that if or when that day ever comes, websites won't any longer charge advertisers directly, they'll just be waiting for their commissions direct from VISA / AmEx / MasterCard etc...?!

I hope so! That would be (excuse the pun)… priceless. :d

We know this much…we have a good number of large yacht owners as members and suspect some heavy hitters are reading YF because a few contracts have come as a direct result of exposure here. I honestly wish I could say more, but I’m walking a thin line disclosing this much. I can tell you this… our advertisers tell me that YF is the leading source of traffic to their websites. The banner stats support this.

I want to share something else that’s important… I could easily increase YF’s revenues by bringing on "outside" advertisers who have expressed an interest and willing to pay big bucks. Thanks, but no thanks. It’s not about the money...

...it’s about community.